more HP for my 96 civic dx?

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I just got a my new car, a 96 civic dx with 35000 miles on it for only 4000 dollars, can any one say CHEAP!!!!!!
Anyways, I want to add more power to the DX engine sinse its not a strong as an EX or an Si, so I was thinking of adding a turbocharger, cold air intake, and maybe lowering the car.

are there any specific brands i should get for this engine, Cause i know what i have to do. Im just not sure which parts have the best bang for my buck... And ofcourse any extra ideas on wt to mod is greately appreciated...

Greately appreciate any help!!!!! and by the way im a rookie so scream at me if you like......lol :screwy:

posted by  ckoolburn

I have a 94 Civic DX, and it is pretty hard to find a turbo for my motor, since everyone uses the VTEC and B16-B18's. Is yours the VTEC? I put a ram air intake on my car and you kind of lose a little low-end torque, hardly noticeable, and I can feel the HP gains. Not a lot, but with a wimpy motor like mine, it helps. I would recommend the AEM or Injen intakes even though I have never used them. I have a generic Ractive one, and it does its job. Good Luck.

posted by  Nickboxer7

DX = no vtec

i have a DX civic hatch... i have spoon exhaust and aem shortram... seems to work alright... for a car not even making 100ponies at the wheels, or should i say wheel... (no lsd) i did race my friend with his 93 civic hatch HX, 1.5 econo-vtec turbo, and i beat him, and hes quite the driver... , then again, im told i am, but i dont beleive it... i think i just got lucky in beating him... but anyways, back on topic...

you can always throw a vtec head on the motor... just need to get anew distributer and a vtec controller, or a vtec ecu... like an EX ecu or something

posted by  mazda6man

You should look into APEX'i Greddy Blitz and all sorts of other good stuff. Just google "Honda performance parts" or "Honda after market parts"

posted by  JDMprelude92

Id recommend going with VTEC rather than anything else.. liked he said... if Honda wanted Turbos they would release the civic in a turbo motor.. but they instead chose VTEC, and a good VTEC can beat a good turbo
:banghead:

posted by  Osiris

ok first off lets get things straight do you want more horsepower or a nice looking car BECAUSE LOWERING THE CAR ISNT GONNA ADD HORSEPOWER.... ok cold air will run between $450-$600 and add 5-10 hp... a turbo would cost $2000 on up and add anywhere between 25-300 horses but remember if you get a turbo YOU HAVE to get an intercooler and then IT IS ESSENTIAL that you change you oil regularly... the turbo runs on a small film of oil, if you dont change it you will blow your turbo out in a heartbeat. also the bigger turbo you have the more turbo lag your going to see so keep your eye on that too.. also headers and exhaust are about $500 and you gain 5-10 there too. but please god dont make you car LOOK fast if it ISNT fast... i see those people and i just want to :banghead: ... well yeah. also be very careful with nitrous oxide. in a 4-banger anything more than a 50 hp shot will more than likely damage your engine depending on what block you have.. is it a manual transmission??? if it is i would look at good clutches and flywheels if your going to make it fast.

posted by  svdiablo979

to be honest, il go ahead and say dont worry about your motor... go suspension! you can do more in a slower car with great suspenseion than you can in a fast car with uber crappy suspension

posted by  mazda6man

lol true that, i love it when i drive up north and i catch up to people on the turns. down here in NZ a lot of people just show off in the straights, when they take it to the turns i catch up, pretty funny

posted by  ahoo

ok first off lets get things straight do you want more horsepower or a nice looking car BECAUSE LOWERING THE CAR ISNT GONNA ADD HORSEPOWER....
No, but if it is done correctly it might just give him better handling. But who wants better handling right? All that matters is brute power. :doh:

ok cold air will run between $450-$600 and add 5-10 hp...
Woah, $600 for an intake. They tend to really range in the $200-$400 depending on the brand name, but they all pretty much do the same thing.

a turbo would cost $2000 on up and add anywhere between 25-300 horses but remember if you get a turbo YOU HAVE to get an intercooler and then IT IS ESSENTIAL that you change you oil regularly...
So its not essential to change your oil regularly if you don't have a turbo? Right... contrary to what you may have been told, you don't need an intercooler to run a turbo setup. While it is highly recommended, its not necessary for the engine to run.

the turbo runs on a small film of oil, if you dont change it you will blow your turbo out in a heartbeat. also the bigger turbo you have the more turbo lag your going to see so keep your eye on that too..
While you are partially correct, not all turbos run on oil. Some are water cooled and while most larger turbos do tend to have their share of turbo lag, a properly tuned setup could be rid of any dangerous turbo lag.

also headers and exhaust are about $500 and you gain 5-10 there too.
He'll definitely see more than 10 extra horsepower with a header and a completely new exhaust.

but please god dont make you car LOOK fast if it ISNT fast... i see those people and i just want to :banghead:
I believe thats his choice what he wants to do to HIS car.

... well yeah. also be very careful with nitrous oxide. in a 4-banger anything more than a 50 hp shot will more than likely damage your engine depending on what block you have
Again, not necessarily true. I've run a number of 4-cylinder engines on a 75-shot nitrous system.

There are basic power adders that most anyone who starts out should use to increase the horsepower of their car. You'll need an intake, short ram or cold air(whatever you prefer). Cat-back exhaust system. This will include everything from the cat-convertor back and not just the muffler or exhaust tips. Intake head and exhaust header. Cam lobes and Cam gears. Other things to consider are performance ECU's, chips, or piggyback fuel systems that can be tuned to increase fuel/air performance. Although one of the most overlooked performance adders are your wheels and tires. No sense in getting horsepower if you can't get it to the ground. Keep in mind that TUNING, not bolt on applications, will make the most power.

posted by  DSMer

yeah your right you dont NEED an intercooler for you car to RUN.. but without one your either going to have to tiny turbo or a car that the first time you race it you burn up the turbo... and while you may have ran 75hp shots through your 4 cyl. i doubt you did it without any damage being done to the engine... and again your right you can make your car look fast without it being fast.. but the first time it got blown away by a car that looks like a P.O.S. your gonna look retarded. oh yeah and number one rule in modifying your car: YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR. so if you decide to buy subpar parts you can expect subpar performance and less durability... lemmie guess, the next thing your gonna tell me is that VTEC is better because it makes 100 hp per liter right?? lol

posted by  svdiablo979

An intercooler is generally required for over 7 pounds of boost. It does help the car's power, and cools the air, but you said;

Which isn't true.



Au contraire, with the proper setup, it won't cause any damage, just wear and tear. (which is very different)


Maybe they didn't make their car to go fast, but rather to look good, by their standards. And what;s your problem with what others like?



VTEC is amazing. variable valve technology raises the max rpm and torque and flattens the hp and torque readings. It's great technology, and used in the same car that's in my sig.

You get what you pay for? If I sold you a 3.8L V6 engine from my taurus for ONE TRILLION DOLLARS!!!! is it going to be the best engine ever? No.....

I suggest you just drop your position now, and ask some questions to straighten out some of your opinions.

posted by  Godlaus

yeah your right you dont NEED an intercooler for you car to RUN.. but without one your either going to have to tiny turbo or a car that the first time you race it you burn up the turbo...

Explain to me how not having an intercooler is going to "burn up your turbo". From what is fact, the intercooler cools charged air from the turbo before entering the intake manifold again. Please maybe I missed something along the way. Enlighten me with how an intercooler designates the temperature of a given turbo.

and while you may have ran 75hp shots through your 4 cyl. i doubt you did it without any damage being done to the engine...

Nope, I've run 75-shots on my 92 GSX more than 8x without any negative effects to the engine. I've also done it to a WRX and a 240SX. Again, with no negative effects to the engine whatsoever.

and again your right you can make your car look fast without it being fast.. but the first time it got blown away by a car that looks like a P.O.S. your gonna look retarded.

Or, you'll simply loose a race. I've lost quite a few races at the track to cars that didn't look better than my car visually. Never once have I felt retarded or anyone has ever called me retarded. You see in the real world of track racing, not that pansy ass cake shit people do on the streets, people are commended for trying and doing good jobs. If you loose a race, you either race someone who is more in a competitive range of your vehicle or you go home and make your car quicker and faster.

oh yeah and number one rule in modifying your car: YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR.

That would apply to anything that you buy in life. A general rule in modifying your car would be to research your products, as with any big purchase.

so if you decide to buy subpar parts you can expect subpar performance and less durability...

Well thank you for allowing me to know such a thing. I never realized that buying a $15,000 car will give me less than a $50,000 car. There is also a difference between buying the same performance parts that are jacked up in price because the contain a certain JDM name on them. $600 for a Honda intake is ridiculously overpriced. I guarantee you that buying a $200 Honda intake versus a $600 Honda intake will make no difference. Its a piece of tubing with a filter on the end. There isn't much room for improvement on that design. As far as durability, its a non-moving part. So long as you're not pulling on it I don't see why even a cheap intake won't last just as long as a flashy $600 unit dipped chrome.

lemmie guess, the next thing your gonna tell me is that VTEC is better because it makes 100 hp per liter right?? lol

No, but you are the one that suggesting that you'll "burn your turbo up" if you don't have an intercooler.

posted by  DSMer

Maybe the exhaust turbine. Compressed air creates heat. More heat as it passes through the engine and the exhaust turbine.

posted by  Godlaus

Meh, you'd have to do some math to determine how hot the exhaust will become if air enters the cylinders at a said temperature. Turbos can operate at glowing red temperatures, wich are well above 1000 degrees, I highly doubt that 50 even 400 degrees of incoming temperature difference will burn the turbo out as long as the adequate cooling source still works at those temperatures.

posted by  DSMer

at low Boost (4-10 psi depending on who you're talking to), it isn't really required, but when you reach double digits, an intercooler is pretty much required. Oil helps, but not enough. I believe that's why the intercooler was creatd in the first place, to cool air, and adding more into the combustion chamber was an added benefit. Oil even solidifies if it's left in the turbo long enough, it's a lot hotter than you can imagine.

posted by  Godlaus

No turbo yet dude. Dont wanna blow the old girl up now do you? Start it out slow, get a good cold air intake from K&N, a 4-2-1 header from DC Sports, Venom throttle body, some Skunk 2 cams, and Greddy catback exhaust. THEN if thats not enough power for you, get a T3 turbo from Turbonetics.

Have fun!!! :thumbs:

posted by  FordFromHell351

I think you're missing my point. I'm not debating whether or not an intercooler would be needed, as I would never build a turbo setup without an intercooler. My point is that the turbo will be within a specific heat range regardless if you have an intercooler or not. An intercooler cools charged air after exiting the extremely hot turbines. As we all know, hot air doesn't make good for carrying oxygen particles and can potentially cause detonation. Thats why you have an intercooler. It allows the charged air to be cooled off before entering the engine. Therefore, a charge air cooler has nothing to do with the specific heat of said turbo.

You're saying that if charged air enters the engine at x temperature, and the "heat of the combustion" will be greater than the final temperature than if the original charged air temperature were y (y being smaller than x of course). Which is somewhat true, but difference between X and Y would have to be almost 200-400ºF to produce in excess of 1742ºF. Which is the maximum amount of temperature most turbos are recommended.

Lets say your average EGT 1600ºF and you couldn't exceed 1742ºF (because your turbo would fail). Thermodynamic laws state that the combustion of fuel and air produces x amount of energy over , lets say, 2 liters of exhaust gas. I already stated the average was 1600ºF. A 14 to 1 air/fuel ratio can detonate at 160-180ºF. So, in order to raise your EGT to 1742ºF from 1600ºF, you would need the incoming air to be around 200-300ºF. Which is impossible because the mixture would detonate before it reached those temperatures. It its evidently true that an intercooler may reduce the EGT, but not by large enough margin to greatly effect the turbos functioning.

Hope that was'nt to confusing. I could explain it in detail if I had all of the chemical makeups of exhaust gas, fuel, and the particles in ambient air. But I'm not going to do a 2 hour thermodynamic equation to prove a simple point. You get the jist of it... hopefully.

posted by  DSMer

If theres anything i kno i can say its a honda. If ur lookin to make major progress with ur car an engine swap is gunna be neccessary. i would suggest the b16 or 18. Secondly stay away from GReddy. Headers go with DC cheap and also good. Dont do a full exhaust system stick with a catback. Intakes i would suggest the AEM CAS or the Injen RAS. Suspension is important but only if u plan on doing more than a 1/4 run. As for turbo, theres plenty out there for your car, i think the site i found mine is www.cheapturbo.com ill check another time and post again for you. Most kits u will find will come with some sort of intercooler and ull be running between 5 and 7 psi. If its a manual i would get an upgraded clutch b4 adding major hp. any questions just ask im here to help with wat i can

posted by  CivicSi

I just skimmed the responses so I may be a bit off the boil with this response, but;

oil is absolutey needed for the turbo for both lubrication and cooling. Water is is not the primary cooling medium;

apart from some minor conduction the compressor side temperature rise is from heat of compression;

an intercooler lowers the specific heat of the charged air. It also introduces lag and flow impedance. It is not required at any pressure, but usually helps. Latent heat of vapourisation from compensating fueling will also lower charge temps.

posted by  Wally

Intercoolers are a given. You will always need a good intercooler when you build up a turbo car. I would go with a Griffin or Spearco.

Oh and although this wouldnt be cheap, you could get a JDM B16 engine. That would give you the power you want, then you can sell the DX engine, and save that money to buy your turbo. I would only use a weaker turbo though if you dont plan on reinforcing your engine. Maybe a with a boost range from 4 to 8 psi. But before you do that, REPLACE YOUR HEADGASKETS!!!

:thumbs:

posted by  FordFromHell351

I think...we're having some communication problems.

It's a moot point now, anyway. Intercoolers are recomended, but not required. it all depends on the application. Wasn't there a NSX powered RWD drag civic, that didn't have any intercoolers on a parrallel turbo system because it utilised some fuel/spark setup that automatically cooled it? Meh, I'll do more research and get back to this setup.

posted by  Godlaus

i may have started a fire!!.. i was wrong about NEEDING an intercooler but if you gonna go balls out and drop the change on a turbo you'd be a fool not to get an intercooler... how about that?? is everyone satisfied with that reply? lol

posted by  svdiablo979

i may have started a fire!!.. i was wrong about NEEDING an intercooler but if you gonna go balls out and drop the change on a turbo you'd be a fool not to get an intercooler... how about that?? is everyone satisfied with that reply? lol. btw i really dont know why im in this forum.. i have an 86' IROC.. and that sure as hell isnt a sport compact....

posted by  svdiablo979

Ah yes, sorry I should have made myself more clear on that subject. There are water-cooled turbos but they are water cooled to keep the oil temperature low enough so that the oil doesn't 'coke'. If such a thing were to happen then turbo failure would be imminent. Good catch Wally-Meister :thumbs: .



Nonsense, you have merely incited forum members to spout, unlike yourself from previous posts, correct information. Again this is a "car-forum", not a sport compact forum. I failed to see where thats stated anywhere.

posted by  DSMer

How do water cooled turbos work? Is it more complicated cause you need to get water from the cooling system?

posted by  CarEXPERT

I'm not really sure where your coming from on this one. First of all, a VTEC has nothing to do with a Turbo. You can even put a Turbo on a VTEC, so how can a good VTEC beat a good Turbo? What if they have both? Second of all there are a lot of cars that don't come with turbos on them and people put them on and whoop up on everyone else. How is that bad?

posted by  Nickboxer7

dude dont't even bother..its a shit car anyway.

posted by  bigv8

lol, it is a shit car.... I should sell it and not bother, but never the less, i learnt alot from this thread, tnx guys :thumbs:

posted by  ckoolburn

do only turbos cause lag? just wondering what other parts cause it, and doesnt a bigger intercooler cause more lag?

posted by  ahoo

turbos cause turbo lag, and a bigger intercooler makes more resistance for the pressurized air to flow through, so it can result in some turbo lag.

posted by  Godlaus

oh ok thnx

posted by  ahoo

What is inside of an intercooler? Like there are piping that goes from the input to the output but is the intercooler hollow or is the pipe goes straight through to the output? Or does the pipe go round and round the intercooler???

posted by  CarEXPERT

i cant say i know alot about turbos or intercoolers but i think an intercooler works kind of like a radiator there are a bunch of little setups inside the intercooler and as the pressurized air goes through it is cooled down before being sent into the engine. i could be 100% wrong but i mite as well try my best to help. if some one can help clear this up i would appreciate the knowledge

posted by  CivicSi

Setups? ther are tubes.

posted by  CarEXPERT

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