Beginning to hate honda people

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I don't know if its just me but honda owners are getting on my nerves lately.

1. I can't go 5min driving either of my cars w/o someone revving their engine. Just the other day i had the a/c on in my 7, stopped at a light, had to keep revs up to 800 so that the car won't die on me. Some middle-aged guy in a accord began revving his engine and looking over at me. Then there are the civics...

2. Everywhere i look there are hondas. Civics and integras are just about everywhere, thankfully i see only a handful of the 5th gen preludes, and no other Eucalyptus preludes in my area. Now i see accords everywhere, new or old, they are just everywhere.

3. I hate the fact that everyone and their mom wants to turbo their civic or accord. I hate even more that people want to swap in the h22 into their civics. For the love of god, they are econo cars! Drive them like they were supposed to be driven. If you are going to make drastic modifications to a car, atleast start with a good platform.

4. I hate how many people think honda technology is the best thing since sliced bread. Honda R&D is good but it ain't that good. VTEC is so hyped its gone well beyond overkill. There are plenty of good alternatives but none of those get this kind of press. I've seen enough dxx/b16/b18 swaps to last a lifetime...

5. I just can't bear to associate myself with these kinds of people.

Bah, the more i think about it the closer i get to insanity. Sometimes i get tempted to sell my prelude and go with something a lot less mainstream.

/rant

posted by  importluva

Ever thought of investing some money in a good ol 350 V8 chevy big block? join the dark side....MUAHAHAHAHAAA!

posted by  sandlercd_22

I sense this thread is going to be filled with many an ignorant post...

And I disagree with your platform argument. They are cheap, and so are parts. Maybe not the best racer for a real, well budgeted professional, but for someone who wants a cheap, tuneable ride, they do well. Keep in mind many other cars were intended to be economy cars, but yet people have modified them into something quite fast on the track.

It's the attitude that's the problem. Not the cars.

posted by  hondaman

The following is an interesting article, presents some interesting arguments:

http://seductiveautosports.tripod.com/honda%20haters.htm

I apologize if this is considered advertising.

posted by  importluva

I would do it in a heartbeat but current gas prices are killing that idea.



This has been argued before. Read the article i posted.


If you come across a similar piece on supras and skylines please post it here. Also note that the purpose of this thread is not to start a pissing match. I will cease arguing the instant senseless fingerpointing, unnecessary cursing, and 5 page essay-arguments are posted. Keep your responses concise and get to the point.

posted by  importluva

I'm sorry...but most of that thread is completely biased bullshit. Please don't say that I'm only saying that because I like Hondas, because anyone who knows me knows that I do, but I also like all other cars. But that entire article, while it does point out a few valid points (such as the VTEC system not being unique to Honda) is completely biased and has still not disproven my comment.

The comment "There is no replacement for displacement" is complete bullshit...very ignorant and incorrect.

posted by  hondaman

Yeh my cars practically a tank....burns gas like one too. I put 20$ into my car with a quarter left before i put it in and it got me up to 3 quarters. Gas is not cheap these days. I hope it ends soon. Im not given up my 73 nova for anything. I think its gonna be like Mad Max soon.

posted by  sandlercd_22

i dont mind done up hondas. Nut what i reall hate is the ones that pull up next to you with a primered bodykit and a fartcan and thats it :cussing:

posted by  mx3_monster

dont forget cheap wal-mart spinners.

posted by  sandlercd_22

You're my hero

posted by  Oomba

rotflmfao i saw a cavvy about a 1995 with a huge wing on it NOS sticckers and spinners which looked like they were gonna fall off :laughing:

posted by  mx3_monster

I hate those spinners...

Importluva, I know what you're talking about. I notice all those kinds of things too. But still, hondas, especially preludes :thumbs: :laughing: are good cars, and a lot of my friends drive civics/accords, its just certain people that are annoying. Like the ones that expect VTEC to be some kinda boost and slam you in your seat as hard as a turbo.

I drive a 5th gen lude too, and they are not THAT mainstream. I like it alot, and plan on keeping it for a while.

In fact I find the civic/accord/integra crowd have some respect for the lude. They pull up in a riced out civic and are like "whoah dude, you got the prelude. is it fast?"

If some noob in a riced out civic starts revving at you, just blow the doors off their car and teach em not to mess with the lude or the 7 :thumbs:

posted by  Vlad

i think i have about 20 differnt cheap Wal-mart hub caps that i found on the road. Yes im a full fledged red-neck for stoping in the middle of tulsa traffic just to pick up a hub cap. Atleast its better than grab n dashin them off of poor defenceless cars :thumbs:. Oh and just to say a word to the wise....if you dont know of course, ANYTHING THAT WALMART SELLS THAT IS INTENDED TO MAKE YOUR CAR LOOK BETTER......SUCKS!

posted by  sandlercd_22

and you are still a closed minded fag!!

posted by  glagon1979

Dude why let what others do to their own car get on your nerves?



Wow, another Oomba in the making. People swap engines or turbocharge them in their cars because they can. They do it for the fun of it and it's so sad that you can't accept this and that you end up bitching about it on a car forum.

And I love this quote from the website you give:

So how come Honda dealers in england has it?

posted by  fudge

:cry:

posted by  SyntheticTrust

im quite sure he meant honda owners that arent cute ;)

posted by  Inygknok

What is so wrong about purchasing a car that is reliable yet affordable?

posted by  SyntheticTrust

I also saw a cavvy with em on it on the expressway. strange thing was all it was all stock with a fart can and those plastic spinners and driving it was some gangster kid with 3 good looking girls in his car. He went to pass me though so i cut him off and blew him away. And that was back when my accord was stock. :laughing:

posted by  GonnaDie4TheGov

Its not people who own Hondas and use them at what theyre best at( getting to and from the grocery store) that I have a problem with. Its the people that think Honda is the best car company out there and if they get a Honda with VTEC then they can beat V8s.

posted by  Oomba

But there are civics that can easily beat v8s

posted by  SyntheticTrust

Hey now brudda, not all of us are like that....

posted by  99integra

Like the 6 second Civic

posted by  99integra

exactly

posted by  SyntheticTrust

Hmm...I think the NSX with a VTEC is beating quite a few V8's out there, actually...and the S2000.

posted by  hondaman

Yeah and there are alot of V8s that can blow doors off of alot of those fart can rice burners :cussing: .

posted by  sandlercd_22

Sooo, I take it you are a new ass belonker?

posted by  99integra

No not ass belonker. And yes i am new. Im not saying the cars arnt bad but when my car is almost twice my age and i can see alot of imports that are just a piece of s**t on the road and mine still runs like new.....all i can say is...NOTHING IS BETTER THAN A CHEVY V8. :cussing:

posted by  sandlercd_22

Do you know how ignorant that sounded, I think an Import'll run stronger and longer than a 350

posted by  99integra

Than you must drive with your eyes closed or something because all i see these days is eather a really nice and well done import wich i have to say comes FEW AND FAR BETWEEN or a piece of s**t rust bucket with cheap ass walmart spinners primered paint with the cheap window tint with the motor sounding like someone is killing a cow.

posted by  sandlercd_22

I think you need to open your eyes peanut and realize that most of the ****ing rust buckets are, ding ding ding, domestics, and how bout you look aside from the damn highschoolers with ricers

posted by  99integra

I just dont like induced horse power (nos) I only like pure muscle. I wanted to accually buy a cheap import and fix it up because i got a friend thatll sell me a body kit but i need a cheap import first and i cant find one for anything cheaper than 400$.

posted by  sandlercd_22

Damn you are stupid, you are getting tired of rice and you are thinking about putting it on

posted by  99integra

Yeh i plan to be a mechanic and that meens i need to learn all feilds of mechanics. Ied be willing to buy one if it was cheap. I guess i jumped the gun on s**t talkin imports and i figure i better try it before i flame it :thumbs: . and yes i know i am stupid.

posted by  sandlercd_22

Dunno if that was reverse psychology or just admitting that you are a dumbass

posted by  99integra

No, that isnt opinionated at all. ChrisV attacks me about this same thing, and yet you are let alone?
I hate to say it but most Japanese cars are far more reliable than the average American car (mostly). Our Chryslers have had far more trouble than my 1999 Toyota Camry CE. All we have had to do to the Camry is oil changes... not the same as the T&C's. Stop being an asshole and learn. :banghead:

posted by  StiMan

No, I catch ignorance

posted by  99integra

Well, it doesnt matter. He just said he is a dumbass.

posted by  StiMan

Yeh i understand im an ass. I do like some of them but other i just cant stand to look at. what would be a good cheap starter imprt if i can ask now that ive pissed off every import guy on this forum :laughing: .Oh and put into mind that i dont have much money so something cheap and workable.

posted by  sandlercd_22

Integra, Civic, Accord, old Celica, Metro

posted by  99integra

I do have to say, that I dont like ricers either. With the fart cannons, the outrageous body kits, huge surf-board-sized spoilers (or "rear wings"), and such. That stuff is pretty damn annoying.

posted by  StiMan

and girl

posted by  SyntheticTrust

I cant stand alot of civics because theres this chick here that likes to try and race me in her light blue civic with her body kit. She also called the cops on me for smokin the tires in the wal-mart parking lot when i was bored with the power out.

posted by  sandlercd_22

BAD CERA!!!

posted by  99integra

Lol, ya. Jeez girl... gettin everyone in trouble... gah... :laughing:

posted by  StiMan

Where is this Cera from?

posted by  sandlercd_22

so...The flaming done?

Yes...Okay.

AJ, If you think that what you go through is bad, its even worse for me. Deuchbags in civics and cavvys that think their car is the shit, funnily enough, don't seem to know JACK about BMWs and thus, whenever they come up to me they think for wahatever reason that my car is slow.

Then, I have to go ahead and beat them senseless.

One thing I do like about it though, is that sometimes its fun to make fun of how slow they are. One time I was driving to my friends house and some retard in his old school maxima pulled up alongside me as I was humming along, and suddenly his car gets louder and he starts inching forward. Which I honestly didn't realize was him trying to race me until he pulled in front of me and turned on his hazards. So I, proceeded to down shift and pass him on the right in order to show him, just for his knowledge, what a fast car looks like when it goes forward. Because if he thought his shit was fast he was obviously misinformed at some point.

But the greatest thing evr happened, as I passed his girlfriendwatched me fly by, and once he finally caught up (2 blocks later) she was laughing at her boyfriend. Then his car got louder again, and I realized he was trying to race me, so With out even downshifting I started tapping the gas so my car lurched forward ahead of him everytime he started pulling up to me. The whole time I was just looking at him out the window smiling. His girlfriend was cracking up, he was pissed and I was laughing my ass off.

So we eventually hit a red, and I say to the guy "nice car, what do you have done?" He didn't say anything but he looked forward and frowned, his girlfriend still laughing, says "not much" So I said "obviously, You know if you ever want to ride in a car that actually has some power, call me at XXX-XXXX"
"hahaha, i'll do that"

She never did, but It made me feel good to know that I hurt a ricers manhood.

posted by  Zalight

New Orleans, she is Synthetic Trust

posted by  99integra

Whoa, now, not true. Your average American car is very reliable. Problem is, they have developed a bad reputation in previous years and every problem they have is looked upon much more harshly than your average import. Good example is my Grandparents 96 Aurora that they recently sold. 9 years old, and that car rarely, if ever, went into the shop or had any maintainance whatsoever. My grandparents just aren't car oriented people. But that car lasted those 9 years without a single problem, breakdown or anything. After 9 years without an oil change, it has begun to smoke somewhat, but that is all. Now if that isn't a testimony to the reliablility and quality of an American car, you'd be hard pressed to find one.

posted by  hondaman

People that buy NSXs usually dont think that way. I hate the NSX because its severely overpriced. 90,000 for a V6 supercar? No way in hell.

I'm talking about the Civic/Accord drivers that slap a CAI and 4" muffler and "are gonna turbo it soon" that think they own the road.

And for god sakes, dont bring up 6 second Civics. NOTHING is stock on those vehicles.

posted by  Oomba

OH BOB SAGET!!
They are still Civics :thumbs:

posted by  99integra

I guess all the funny car dragsters that run 4's and 5's count as what car they share only the shell with then, too.

posted by  Oomba

Still, its still a Civic

posted by  99integra

So what? Is this any different from select Cavaliers, Focuses (not ZX-3), Corollas, Camrys, 626s, Neons, etc that are seen running around with bodykits, fartcans, and not a damn thing under the hood? Yet those seem to go unnoticed and unbitched. I am so goddamn tired of one brand being blamed for an entire fad. Get the hell over it.

posted by  hondaman

I said average and mostly, not all. There are several reliable American cars out there, but on average, they arent. I am not dissing all American cars, just a good amount of them. :thumbs:

posted by  StiMan

Im not trying to diss on every honda owner. My problem is not with people like SyntheticTrust who have little interest in their car apart from going from point A to point B. My problem is with people who try to turbo their front wheel drive econo sedans and then proceed to race every car on the road. I only ask that people drive their cars in the way they were meant/designed to be driven.

posted by  importluva

To answer your first question: They endanger me and the drivers around me.

Most don't know anything about what turbocharging does to their cars. Cars have multiple dimensions, turbocharging is only one. A car first has to be able to handle the added power, incl. brakes, suspension, aerodynamics, tires, and saftey feature upgrades that need to be done. On a car like the S2000 which is already been designed to take such abuse, turbocharging has less sideaffects, but on a car like a civic, things get very complicated. Most owners of civics/accords/what-have-you think slapping a turbo on will do the trick but thats not the case.

As for swapping engines, it pains me to see a h22 in anything other than a prelude. My reason for having a prelude is because of its unique engine, its beautiful design, and my car's color. Without these, the prelude is just like any civic.

The article i posted simply for amusement since it has to do with the topic at hand.

posted by  importluva

I can think of several domestics that are incredibly cheap to modify, repair, service, search and buy, etc. Cheap tunable rides don't have to be civics, and imo, shouldn't be.

A good platform is very important, for the reasons i underlined in one of my posts above. Far fewer essential modifications need to be made in a platform built for turbo applications or 'go fast'. Take for example the Lancer Evolution. It was designed to go fast, handle rough terrain, handle inclement weather, handle high power levels. The engine, brakes, suspension, transmission, aerodynamics, etc. have all been designed and put in the car specifically with those purposes in mind.

In concise terms, a turbo application has to be done correctly in order to make high hp cars even reasonably controllable. What does this say about your everyday civics?

posted by  importluva

So its really nothing worth bragging about, because there are Mustangs and GTOs out there running 4s.

posted by  Oomba

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b47/99integra/owned1.jpg

posted by  99integra

???

I'm just saying, bragging about a Civic body that runs 6s is as stupid as bragging about a Dragster running 3s that had one bolt from a Ford Tempo, it doesnt help the argument.

posted by  Oomba

Oomba, just give up.

posted by  SyntheticTrust

That is a good point. How far can one upgrade a car before it is no longer the car that one started work on. I.E.: If one takes a Civic and does a complete redesign to decrease drag, increase air flow and HP, increase stability, and change the panels on the outside for lighter materials, etc., but it has a few parts from the origonal car, is it still classified as a Civic even if these materials are as simple as the headlights or something that (respectively speaking) is quite insignificant? Sorry if this completely hijacks the thread, Ill make a new one if you all wish, but this question plagues me.

posted by  StiMan

I can't get this piece of shit to let me type in my full post, so I will respond to each paragraph in a separate post. First:

So can I, but it's a matter of personal preference, and at the moment, this is what people are choosing.

posted by  hondaman

Second: How many "modders" can afford a good Lancer? Not too many. I don't know if they are really as available as you seem to think they are either, at least here they aren't. I rarely see one. "Rough Terrain"? WTF? I don't think many Civic drivers intend to take their cars offroading. As far as the brakes, suspension, etc...most people who slap a turbo on a Civic do so only intending to increase acceleration in a straight line, not to cruise the interstate at 130 or win road races. If they think they can, or try to, then they are simply foolish and uneducated. Now, should someone choose to do so, installing stiffer suspension components and proper brakes would not be that expensive or difficult of a task. Now as far as the aerodynamics...if they are going fast enough for that to be a factor then they are either being foolish or playing on a completely different field (racing). A stock Civic can handle 80 mph on the interstate perfectly well, why would a turbocharged Civic be any different? Like I said, if someone attempts to go greatly faster than that without the proper equipment, they are simply being foolish.

posted by  hondaman

Third: An average street Civic that has been turbocharged will be pushing maybe 200 hp, if that much. I don't think that will be too much for it to handle. Now, should someone have the time and money to push the hp even further, I'm sure shelling out a bit more to improve the car's control and stability will not be too difficult (although I do think at this point, there are far better choices available). But the point is, your average, turbocharged Civic can be a fun, reasonably quick, inexpensive little package for a young (or older) driver.

posted by  hondaman

Back to the original post;

Actually, it depends on what department of technology you are looking at. The Japanese Spec Honda Legend (Acura RL) is one of the most advanced cars on the road right now. It is equipped with Night Infrared technology, with the ability to tell the driver visually (VIA a Screen on the dash) and by buzzer (more like beeping sounds) that someone or something is in teh car's path or about to travel into the path. Also, it is equipped with Radar (found in some other luxury cars as well; Cadillac, Mercedes, and i think BMW), it senses the the distance of the car in front and tells the driver if they can't stop in time, or if the car ahead stops suddenly. Theres also the seatbelt system; the seatbelt pre-tensions when the radar senses the car can't stop in time, or whenever the car predicts there will be an accident. There are more, but the rest of the description was in Japanese, so i don't know what else there is on top of the already extremely advanced American Spec RL.

The funniest racing story from me, is this guy in his SRT-4 pulls up beside me, he revs his engine like crazy. The light changes, of course he pulls off the line faster then me, my car is like 500lbs heavier then his. Then he starts celebrating, he starts honking and turns his hazard lights on, then i just blow past him, his face was full of disbelief, just shocked. I hear his car behind me, it started getting louder, and he tries to catch up, i hit sixth gear, he didnt have a chance. Later on, i'm driving normal again, he's behind me again, it was one lane traffic, so i decide to piss him off. And for one hour on the way up the mountain on the mountain pass i just drive 30miles per hour, and he can't pass me. He was honking and flashing me with his headlights.

haha. :hi:

posted by  aerith

Im not saying domestic cars THESE DAYS are good cars. Now in days everything is made fast and cheap. Wich is why they crap out so easily. Everything is plastic n cheaply made. I am saying NOTHING IS BETTER THAN A CHEVY V8 because there isnt anything that could or has lasted as long as muscle cars have. The car i owned was sitting for atleast 10 years in a empty lot and when it was finally drug out of there it still turned over. You cant say that in 10-20-even 35 years that a normal everyday import will still be on the road like new unless you meen to keep it new on some velvet covered garage floor under a lock and key. All im saying is theres nothing better. My cars a tank and will drive till the day i die. God forbid i get into a accedent ill still give it life no matter what.

posted by  sandlercd_22

Then again, everything nowadays seems to be made to purposely last a certain amount of time, that way the manufacturers will always have customers. I may be wrong, but thats just how most things seem now, older cars were built to last.

posted by  car_crazy89

What are you talking about? Like new? Was your chevy v8 like new? I don't think so. You leave any car, ANY, alone for 20-35 years, it isnt going to be like new. You can leave a domestic or any import for the same amount of years, they will be in the same damn condition. Are you ignorant? They are made out of the damn same materials. They are all made out of coated steel, save the luxury cars. Actually , a lot of domestics still use iron blocks, so i would think that the aluminum alloy blocks of most imports would last longer.

Just because you don't see import cars from the age of the muscle cars around, doesn't mean they are weak and busted up. The reason muscle cars last so long its because they have a fan base, they have been preened, taken care of nicely. But import cars of that age weren't performance oriented, so why would anyone want to keep their 1969 Toyota Corolla mint? Why would anyone want to restore a 1970 Honda N200, or a 1958 Toyota Land Cruiser? Also, considering the time period when muscle cars of detroit were produced, Honda, Toyota and Nissan only sold a fifth of the amount of cars sold by their Domestic counterparts. In 1970, their combined sales number would probaly be around 8000-12000 cars, but the sales number of Domestics would be considerably higher; more like 42000+. If Toyota of Honda made perfermance oriented cars in that decade, then they will be here, just like the muscle cars. The Datsun Z is a good example, many people still restore Datsun Z's and many people keep them in mint condition. And if you leave a Datsun Z in a car lot for 10 years, it will still turn over like your muscle car. So don't go saying, that muscle cars outlast imports just because there are more of them.

A tank is a good description though, a lot of excess metal there. Too much for my taste. Don't get me wrong, i like muscle cars too, i would rather have a Shelby GT500 (not the stupid showy eleanor model) over a toyota supra. But you are really narrow minded, just because you own it, doesnt mean its the best. Its the best in your mind, but to many people, that may be offensive, so watch what you say, and use a filter in between your brain and your mouth.

posted by  aerith

Ok than you take your import w/e car you got and park it at one end of the street facing mine at the other and lets play chicken....who you think will win in a head on collision?

posted by  sandlercd_22

Actually, they are. A great number of Domestic cars today are competing for quality with Japanese imports. It's good to see that.

posted by  hondaman

And who's more likely to survive a 50 mph collision into a concrete barrier? That's why cars today are designed to crumple upon impact.

posted by  hondaman

The NSX is a 15 year old (well 16 year old now) car. It hasnt ever been fully resdesigned and it was considered a bargin supercar in the early 90s. I agree it's lagging fully behind all supercars now, but Honda just announced in 3-4 years they will have a V10 powered NSX.

posted by  thunderbird1100

You realized you're not only ragging on street machines but also RACING built vehicles?

So, why are you to say words that with my old turbo h22a Accord I am not allowed to turbo it? I should of left it at 130hp instead of having fun with it by dropping in a 200hp h22a then turboing it to make a sleeper... You have no base.

posted by  thunderbird1100

Show me a GTO or a Mustang that can do 4's then that point will be valid.


Well you're doing a good job of pissing off every Honda owner.


SO what? It's not YOUR Prelude which is having it's engine put into Civics.

posted by  fudge

Not just Honda owners but Acura owners :banghead:

posted by  99integra

Ok, **** this. I am making my own thread... :banghead:

posted by  StiMan

You dont own an Acura

posted by  SyntheticTrust

:cry: I diiiiid

posted by  99integra

Your Acura is gone. You'll never drive it again. Let's face it, you were never meant to be an Acura owner and you never will be.

posted by  SyntheticTrust

*crying and throwing shit*
DIRTY BITCH, ASS BELONKIN SLUT THAT THROWS HER PICS ALL OVER THE INTERNET LIKE A CYBER BITCH :cussing:

posted by  99integra

You're damn right. Gotta love Da Dirty Souf girls :finger:

posted by  SyntheticTrust

Go wash those crabs out we already know you're dirty

posted by  99integra

God Steven, Enough post whoring already.

posted by  SyntheticTrust

Aww look, shes trying to run away from the fact that shes a dirty WHORE :smoke:

posted by  99integra

:cry: I can see I'm no longer wanted here. Goodbye.

posted by  SyntheticTrust

Fly bitch, go find a new home

posted by  99integra

Damn. I thought you guys were friends...

posted by  StiMan

What the hell is going on here?


And what the hell is the matter with you man?

posted by  hondaman

Shit..... :screwy: :doh: WTF man?

You need to chill the **** out right now man. :banghead:

posted by  SlipKnoT

Damn 99 take a chill pill bro. Don't let synthetic get on you shes just making an ass out of herself. This whole thread I think was started to start arguments amongst others and shit.

posted by  Spanky2324

WTF? Since when was there a big block 350? 350's like the LS1, LT1, and all previous 350's since the 60's when Nova's, Chevelle's, and Camaro's had them, have always been called "small" block Chevys. Big blocks usually start with the number 4, as in 427, 429, and 409, not 318, 327, and 350. Even the new Z06 is a small block and it displaces 427 cubes. In comparison to Civic's and other sub 2 liter cars, that engine is very big, but it certainly not a Chevy big block.

posted by  VG30DE

Ya'll need to realize that me and her were just ****in around :screwy:

posted by  99integra

I dont think theres a winner when you have a collision :ohcrap:

But to be honest i think he'd 'win' (live) BUT your car would still be easily salvageable.

posted by  car_crazy89

he's just mad b/c we "outed" him in another thread... :laughing:

*looking aroud wildly* holy crap! how'd i end up in asian imports??? :oops:

posted by  dodger65

Oh jesus give it UP :banghead:

posted by  99integra

This must be one of the most asinine statements ever.

The only reason a muscle car from the 60s or early 70s is running and in good condition today is...

A. It was fully restored.
B. It was rebuilt more than once.
C. It was kept in a "velvet covered garage floor" for most of life and saw no more then 50,000-75,000 miles in 35 years (a whopping 2000 miles/year max).

People who drive Accords and Civics (like my Accord) dont SAVE them...most of us probably wont rebuild them...and certainly no one will fully restore one. My 1990 Accord has seen 221,000 miles in 16 years (about 14,000 miles/year). It will probably run until 300k-400k no problem if I keep up routine main. Its never had one single repair done to it that it has needed. Sure it'll rust a little, but what 20-25 year old car wouldnt that's driven daily? You HAVE to understand the people who drove these old muscle cars daily for 100-200k miles are now all rusted out and not running (unles they are restored or rebuilt).

posted by  thunderbird1100

*laughing evilly*

:evil: ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha :evil:

posted by  dodger65

You are missing my point entirely. First of all most 'modders' do nothing except slap a turbo on and start racing on the streets. A proper, safe turbo application REQUIRES (this can NOT be a choice) all aspects of the car to be revised in order keep the car in control and protect its passenger. It is for this reason that i cited the Evolution, which has been specially designed by its manufacturer for turbo and high hp. A civic was NOT designed for turbo applications. It is NOT safe to simply slap a turbo on and run around the streets in a civic, regardless of speed or location. This applies not only to civics but accords, sentras, and other econo cars.

If done properly a civic can be a perfectly good turbocharged car but most 'modders' don't take the necessary steps.

THIS is the point im trying to get at.

posted by  importluva

How so? If a stock Civic can handle a particular corner at a certain speed and brake from that speed at a given interval and be perfectly safe, why would a turbo one be any different at that speed?

posted by  hondaman

My beef with people swapping h22s into their own cars is a personal problem and a personal perference. If you feel dropping a h22 into your accord will bring joy to you, then by all means. You are free to do whatever you wish.

I only ask that you inspect all facets of your car for essential upgrades when upgrading to an engine with considerably more pop and later turboing that engine. It will save your life and mine.


Also, if everybody could keep the drama out of this thread and stick to the topic at hand. No post whoring please. If one of the mods could delete the posts not pertaining to the thread it would be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

posted by  importluva

If the premise is that the civics approach the corner with the same speed to take a turn, there will be no difference and you are right. This premise, however, does not comprehensively cover all possibilities.

The biggest reason for turbocharging a car is for added power. It is safe to assume that the turbocharged civic will be driven more aggressively to take advantage of the greater acceleration and ability to get up to speed. This is after all the purpose for turbocharging the car in the first place.

As a result, the brakes have to take much more abuse and have to control more power than they can handle (assuming the brakes are the stock civic brakes). You also need to consider whether the stock civic transmission can handle the extra power. Aerodynamics is for stability at high speeds but it can not be ignored. There are idiots who try to reach new heights with their more powerful car, etc.

Once again, the basic point im trying to make here is that your premise is too narrow. You have not considered all possibilities.

posted by  importluva

No it's not. I've already concluded that anyone that attempts to exceed the limit of thier cars is simply a fool. Turbocharging a Civic can improve around town acceleration and highway power, improving the driving experience. Those that think their car can do more are simply uneducated, and shouldn't be trusted with any car. What continually resurfaces is that the problem is in the people, not the cars.

posted by  hondaman

It held together just fine even until I sold it.

If I got hit or in an accident before or after all the mods it didnt matter, I'd be ****ed anyway. No airbags, light car and too many SUVs on the road (only thing to save me was the seatbelt...). What, did you expect me to install a roll cage in a daily driving car that carried passengers all the time? Or perhaps spend thousands of dollars in getting a custom airbags job? You just cant see it from a bigger perspective.

Honestly man, just worry about yourself. Dont worry about other people. Let people do whatever the hell they want and dont try and spoon feed them. People learn from mistakes. Dont try and be a fat liberal government and give welfare out to all the people who "need" it...

posted by  thunderbird1100

First of all, from different ends of the block, our acceleration and speed would be similiar because there isnt enough distance for your to gain speed, and my car is every bit as heavy as yours, that means we would have the same momentum. Second of all, your car has virtually no saftey precautions. I would survive, you would be dead, i have 8 airbags, crumple zones all over the place. I would survive maybe suffer from whiplash and take a pain killer every day, but i won't be the one in the coffin. Sure my car is totaled, but hey, i killed a arrogant little jerk like you. So, you win some you lose some, i can't have the cake and eat it too.

You win, your car is salvageable, probaly will need a new engine, but there is one problem; your lying sprawled on the cement with a white chalk outline.

posted by  aerith

Have you not read what i have been arguing all this time? Did i mention rollcages?

Don't be so naive as to think i give a flyin f*ck about anyone on this board. To worry about myself is to worry about which idiot is going to cause me to be in an accident. Those idiots include people improperly equipped cars. You speak of bigger perspective...such irony. :rolleyes:

posted by  importluva

You are more likely to be killed from someone drunk or distracted(talking on their mobile phone) on the road than someone who's car has just a turbo slapped on it.

posted by  fudge

That is true! I almost hit two people trying to get out of Walmart last night because I was talking to a Tattoo Artist on my cell phone.

posted by  SyntheticTrust

Great. I swear, you guys are never going to learn anything.

Right at a the start, in big bold letters, "I dont' want an essay."

Of course not. You want sound bites like the rest of your generation. No wonder you guys don't know anything. Knowledge doesn't come in sound bites. it's why textbooks are more than one page long.

posted by  ChrisV

99% of people who slap on turbo kits probably have the suspension really re-worked over too (obviously they have the money). So what's your point...that doesnt make any sense if that's your point. Not like you ever see on the news "Person with ill-prepared turbocharged modified Accord slams into van of five, tonight at 7:00!". And you know news people would be all OVER a story like that.

posted by  thunderbird1100

Very true...i ran a stop sign b/c of my cell and was missed being hit by a few inches and a truck who was paying attention lol. I would have died if she didn't see me. No wonder NJ has banned cell phones while driving :doh:

posted by  GonnaDie4TheGov

That's why all the newer cars are outfitted with built-in handsfree units. My car has it, its actually quite useful, less dangerous, there are buttons on my steering wheel that links to the cell phone. But i gess i can still get distracted, but at least i still have both hands on the wheel and i can react faster if something comes up.

posted by  aerith

I don't agree. Furthermore, thats still not enough.

posted by  importluva

Wait please tell me why that is not sufficient enough :screwy:

posted by  99integra

You are probably right, but there are laws in place for DUIs and cell phones (atleast in some states). There isn't much to do here that hasn't already been done. No such laws or recognition for modified cars that im aware of...

posted by  importluva

How can you not agree with that. If someone can afford a $3000-$4000 mod, you think that they would NOT be smart enough to upgrade the suspension. WTF else do you want them to do??? I've never come across ANY turbocharged Honda that didnt have major suspension work too.

posted by  thunderbird1100

The sensible ones do the suspension mods

posted by  99integra

Im confused by your post. Im also amused at how you make assumptions so easily and go on and on about it. If we try to argue our case, you begin to get worked up and become impulsive. Anyways, this topic is for another thread.

posted by  importluva

I think most people's idea of suspension is a lowering kit off ebay, very few people take the time and money to invest in a good suspension setup. I've already said what else needs to be checked in a modified car...

So far all that has been discussed is the modified car and how it is/is not adequetely equipped for reasonably safe street driving, but the greatest and most influential factor is the driver.

I hope most of you will agree that there are many idiot drivers out there, many whom if given a decently powerful car will find themselves seriously injured, killed, or cause death and damage. Now imagine these people with even more powerful turbo cars, cars ill equipped to handle that kind of power, trying to race people on public streets and highways and invariably killing themselves and others in the process...

Some of these people don't even know how to drive a normal economy car, let alone a decently modified car. The only reasonable solution is more stringent driving tests, maybe even raise the minimum age for having a license/permit. Discuss.

posted by  importluva

You obviously know people that half ass everything

posted by  99integra

The problem with raising the minimum age is; it won't do anything. I remember right after i got my Novice license, all the rules i had to abide for the driving road test; i totally forgot, well at least till the excitement of driving like an idiot got old and i became a responsible driver. I think the only way to prevent people from driving like morons is put more cops on the streets, and set up radar cameras at every intersection. That is the only way to scare people from driving like idiots and racing on the street.

posted by  aerith

STFU man. Ur just pissed because thats all you could get, a nasty ass bitch with one eye, crabs, and 3 teeth. Shes more than you could ever get.

posted by  sandlercd_22

Uh....what? :screwy:

posted by  hondaman

About that guy calling that one chick a bitch n a whore. srry i just got to reading it all. :laughing:

posted by  sandlercd_22

Ah, I see. He was just kidding you know. :laughing:

posted by  hondaman

Oops... :banghead:

posted by  sandlercd_22

Trust me, we kid like that :wink2:

posted by  99integra

You never stop to think that you don't actually know what you're talking about before you argue it. Your first impulse IS to argue, even if you've not lifted a finger to research your case or to see if you neede more than 5 minutes of thought on teh subject to validate your opinion. You guys can't even be bothered to do rudimentary research before sumbitting a reply. When you argue your case, you make sure to use easily refutable statements that would have been proven wrong even before you made them had you actually used a couple brain cells towards research before hitting "submit."

And you don't want to read thorough, researched, substantiated and supported posts. I've even posted thororugh, researched long posts here giving out information calmly with no other motive than to give information and been met with "thart's too long to read" or " I'm not reading all that"

This thread is FULL of mistakes in assumptions, and you tell me *I'M* the one making assumptions? You made them from your first post:



That statement makes you an Oombah.


I'm tired of spending time making sure my information is accurate before posting, giving thorough responses, and making sure my experience is relevant, and you little kids INSTANTLY argue with it, even though you've done ZERO but form a quick opinion on the subject. Like this one. You just form an opinion and there's no duscussing it. Don't bother you with the facts, your mind's made up. Doesn't matter that you've given it less than a day of thought. Your first impluse IS to "argue your case" insted of actually try to f*cking learn. So now I just respond like this instead of try to help you learn anything, as it's apparent all you want to do is form quick opinions (it's apparently what passes for learning anymore).

Yes, I have opinions. Most of them have been formed over decades of careful study. And if I don't know enoguh about the subject, I don't VOICE any opinion and I defintiitely don't ARGUE it. I LEARN about it and if the facts I learn don't match the opinion I already have, then I change the opinion to match the new facts, rather than to argue that my opinion is valid. I'm interested in architecture and do a bunch of architectural visualization for a living. But it would be stupid of me to go on an architects message board and argue my opinions of the subject with people who have been architects for decades.

But this whole thread is an opinion-fest that would take pages of careful refutation and documentation to get the concepts across. And you said right from the first page that you don't WANT that. You want concise sound bites.

posted by  ChrisV

lol same damn thing.

posted by  VG30DE

Thats what makes you an idiot Chris. You cant LEARN that opinions are not based on facts. If opinions were based on facts, then they would BE facts. You cant find facts to support "I dont like that car", and nor should anyone need to. Its their opinion, and nothing is going to change that. "Oh, so it runs 10s? I still dont like it," is a perfectly viable opinion.

posted by  Oomba

If you are willing to give us your 'expert' advice, then please do so in doses. This way all of us can settle our differences on an issue by issue basis.

posted by  importluva

:'( :ohcrap:

posted by  odds

What the hell are you bitchin about?

posted by  99integra

i think you hurt his feelings stevo, calm down buddy.

posted by  HyundaGuy

What the hell, not my fault that I stated my opinion and someone is crying about it, ya'll need to grow up and say why you didn't like about it instead of doing that lil :ohcrap:

posted by  99integra

Shit, I have seen tons of cars that have had nothing but power upgrades.
sti's with prodrive or possum bourne ecu's, big front mounts and bigger turbos, thousands spent and nothing done to suspension, brakes, or anything similar. Alot even have bought the latest wheel and tyre combo and cheaped out on the tyres. so end up with worse rubber than came standard on the car in the first place.

second to that, alot of them have just done a lowering spring kit and boast about aftermarket suspension :banghead:

Just my own opinion, but shouldn't the first mod you do be doing an advarnced driving course??? I beleive bmw and ferrari both offer this for free when you buy a car from them. Well at least when you buy the M3 csl they do! Just a thought as most of the owners of these high power sports cars (these days anyway withthe jap turbos and the like) are young people with very little experiance.


I've sold cars to alot of em, take it from me there are alot of kids out there with more money than sense and I feel guilty to have sold them cars that I know could (probably will) kill them or someone else.

Over here in NZ a 15 year old can buy any car they want and drive on a learners license without insurance legaly!!! I like the system back home (UK) compulsary insurance. That way if you can't get insured in a wrx sti at 16 you can't buy one, you have to spend a couple years building your insurance rating up in slow cars before any chance of getting a fast car.

Maybe a similar system to the bike license rules here and UK, different grades of test for different power ratings? What do ya reakon?

posted by  relicensed

Theyre called funny car dragsters. Try watching drag racing on tv one day.

posted by  Oomba

k all of you complain complain complain, this is purely a taste thing, if you dont like those civics pullin up and rev, just race them and kick their assses if you can, and another thing all you guys talk bout are drag situations a straight road something a 16 year old kid with his dads mustang can do that and kick your ass, but if you put a honda prelude on a course track against a v8 mustang or w/e with 400hp on 400lb of torque, dont think its gona matter if the preludes got a good driver the mustangs gona lose despite the mustang has 400hp with a big ass engine, shit, think bout it ppl different situations diff cars, it all depends all you guys think is a pussy straight line drag race and trust me just cuz its a civic in a drag dont mean its got nothin, my friend owns a civic si hatchback and with some mods liek turbo and shit hes kickin mustangs and wrx sti's the "super" fast cars psh so plz ppl just quit complainin with treads like these just a waste of time, shit

posted by  chibi

you know those r just fiberglass shells right?

posted by  airmanUSN

Its b/c his power to weight ratio is better than that of a heavy domestic car and if he is beating sti's...wow they must suck as drivers

posted by  GonnaDie4TheGov

i was going to break your quote up into smaller chunks to address individual statements, but it seems to be one giant run-on sentence. fine. if your (hypothetical) civic is so great in the curves, but not so great in a straight line--challenge me on a curvy road, that's fine. don't pull up to me on 2 lanes of straight road and challenge me--- it's just plain annoying unless you have something non-stock under the hood. in about 95% of the cases i've encountered, you dont. do you see musclecars pulling up to civics revving their engines?-no.

and as far as your friend's civic w/ the turbo and other mods... that's great for him. i wish more people that aspired to be tuners and can only afford (or can only justify affording) the exterior mods and fart cans would end up like your friend. that kind of civic i would welcome a challenge from any day. not necessarily b/c i think i would win, but b/c it would be a good contest betw/ 2 modified vehicles, not me wasting gas b/c some kid thinks his fart can and stickers make him fast. (not that i'm advocating street racing) but the civic that's stock under the skin and looks like something from "pimp my ride" bugging people at lights is just irritating...

more actual tuners and less ricers, please...

the ricers are giving the legit tuners a bad name....

posted by  dodger65

I do agree with you. I have a stock accord and its nothing special...i don't try and race anyone by reving my engine at a light. Around me all there is are Civics and Cavvys that swear they are the shit with big wings and mufflers. I find it fun that my stock accord can beat them and they get all mad :laughing:

posted by  GonnaDie4TheGov

For the love of our government go get an education.

posted by  thunderbird1100

exactly. i spanked one of those cars the other day w/ my '05 E250 w/ 600 pounds of ice machine in the back... wouldn't even look at me at the next light... :thumbs:

posted by  dodger65

Lmao, this reminds me of one night my friend with a 93 Probe GT got revved at by a turbo intercooled Dodge Spirit( I think). He won, and the Spirit yelled "lets go again!" so we decided to mess with him and my friend made it look like he was launching and the Spirit decided to but we turned. Good stuff.

posted by  Oomba

I love my stock accord... i dont even waste my time racing those little civics with theyre bass booming real high with kid driving with his gangsta lean on. its pathetic. I just point and laugh at the huge alluminum ajustable he has strapped on the back and the fart can stickin out the bottom.

posted by  A-cord

i have to agree with the original post in cville everyone and their brother has a honda something and does all sorts of mods . dont take me wrong i like hondas but everyone has one and they all wanna race here. no offense towards anyone i like civics and all but pick something that no one else is modding up like a corrola or a mx3 thats all and this isnt a pissing contest at all just be original thats what makes modding fun. :smoke: :thumbs:

posted by  widget

Thus the reason i like that im taking my time with my Accord and there are no other modded Accords around here cept for the early 90's ones

posted by  GonnaDie4TheGov

there arent many accords modded here either so good luck with it and have fun in the process thats the best part id like to see pics as u go :thumbs:

posted by  widget

You can check out my Accord anytime
http://www.cardomain.com/ride/2086579

Though im on hold right now..gotta get a few maintance things done with so i can pass inspection lol

posted by  GonnaDie4TheGov

looks and sounds nice so far. i have a big wish list with my 99 eclipse to . just build it slowly and they will come hehehe :thumbs:

posted by  widget

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