Holden Statesman released in China

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Rebadged but it's a Statesman (http://www.worldcarfans.com/news.cfm/newsid/2070412.001/country/acf/buick- park-avenue-luxury-sedan-launched-cn)

posted by  Wally

I wouldn't think there is a huge demand for those in China lol.

posted by  chris_knows

You're kidding, right? The automobile industry in China is booming due to vastly increased personal incomes and prices on cars coming down after joining the WTO which makes importation easier. Sales of new cars in China has grown something along the lines of 35% PER YEAR for the last several years. They are now #2 in sales volume of new cars, behind only the USA and are projected to overtake us sometime in the next 5-10 years. Chinese are no different than Americans, Canadians, Australians or Martians for that matter. They all want to keep up with the Joneses.

GM has made a huge commitment to sell cars over there already. Cadillac is selling for or five different models in China right now. The SLS is selling for almost $100k (stupid money) and are going out the door fast.

So how about explaining to us why wouldn't there be a "huge demand for those" or any other car for that matter in China. I'd love to know why.

posted by  vwhobo

What's written below is what I know from what I've read (not much) and learned in school (still not much) about China, none of it is necessarily true.

I thought the country was still developing and, being a communism would mean that everyone makes the same amount of money. From my understanding, lots of people work in sweatshops and on rice farms.

Also, from what I know, domestic luxury vehicles in other parts of the world are seen as tanks.

I guess with that many people living there, there's going to be a demand though.

posted by  chris_knows

Okay, so then explain this to me. By your own admission you spend your life on a computer, and I know from experience that you're always searching for information or whatever. Why is it whan you get called for saying something completely off base, you claim to have no knowledge except what you learned at school.

Something doesn't make sense.

posted by  vwhobo

No, I do that when you call my claims lol. When you say something, odds are it's right. Why would I start arguing about something I know nothing about? If some other member (let's call him Cliffy) challenged one of my statements, I would make sure he was right - do some research and tell him who was actually right - no point arguing against facts.

I do spend a lot of time looking stuff up, but stuff that interest me; not so much the Chinese economy. lol

posted by  chris_knows

Although China is technichally a communist state they really aren't anymore. My history teacher actually went there last summer and was surprised at how different it was then he expected.

posted by  Ferny

Couldn't you have called him ChrisV or something? I'm in the firing line now! :laughing:

With regard to the Chinese motor industry, the most recent news I heard of it was that Shanghai Automotive had bought the rights to MG Rover and are about to re-release the comapany so to speak. This alone says to me that China has a booming motor industry, for them to even consider buying Rover. I guess in this scenario only time will tell, but as far as the car Wally showed us goes, it certainly looks as good as any European/Domestic rival's car would be cosmetically!

posted by  Cliffy

Yeah, but when was the last time ChrisV was wrong? :laughing:

posted by  chris_knows

When he said the Fiat Multipla wasn't ugly, lol.....jk.

You didn't say anythin about me being wrong, you just said if I was to challenge one of your statements, you'd check that I was correct......I guess what you're saying is that there's no need to cross referrence ChrisV's info, lol :laughing:

posted by  Cliffy

ChrisV will argue with you until you think your information is wrong...and he'll make you cry a couple of times along the way :laughing:. You're just the one that gets the blame most of the time here lol :wink2:

posted by  chris_knows

China potential is huge. Chris_Knows, my daughter came back from a visit to China recently and commented how there is indeed a vast population that appear to be subsistance survivors, however with such a large population there are conspicuously many that are wealthy. They all seem to like drowning their food with beer though.

Holden are selling the commodores as knock down packs for assembly in China, rebadged as American saloons to garner the prestige town car tag. The units sold to the middle east are shipped complete from the Oz factory, but similarly rebadged American.

Interesting how the Oz, Middle East and Asian markets still cater to the RWD cars, but in the US, Ford and GM are reconciling the new emmissions targets which may see RWD disappear within a few years in favour of FWD.

posted by  Wally

Disappear is an exaggeration, right?

posted by  chris_knows

When he uses the word disappear, it means he doesn't have as strong a grasp on the future of the US automotive market as he thinks he does. The use of RWD platforms for cars in the US is on the upswing, and looks to be for the forseeable future. And that doesn't even include the light truck market because, well... They're not cars.

In other words, completely diregard his last paragraph in that post. The opinion/information is incorrect.

posted by  vwhobo

Gotcha...Kinda reminds me of Godlaus' FWD (http://www.car-forums.com/talk/showthread.php?t=18579) thread.

posted by  chris_knows

That one could come back to bite you on the bum.:wink2: I was merely parroting the opinions of a certain well known company president made over the last week or so. If the boss of GM is getting the future directions wrong, then there's going to be a lot of stock sitting in the factory come 2010.

"It's too late to stop the Camaro, but anything after that is questionable or in a bubble"........."We don't know how to get 30% better mileage from rear wheel-drive cars. We'll decide on our rear-drive cars when the Govt, etc..""

posted by  Wally

Wally, I expected better from you. Your "facts" are not factual, even the simple ones. I'm sure Bob Lutz (http://fastlane.gmblogs.com/archives/2005/01/lutz_biography_1.html) would like to be the "well known company president" or "boss" of General Motors, and I'm quite sure his paycheck looks like he is, but the FACT is that he is only(?) GM Vice Chairman, Product Development, and Chairman, GM North America. That is unless you have some inside information that General Motors or Troy Clarke (http://www.gm.com/company/investor_information/corp_gov/bios/clarke.htm) doesn't know about.



Now to the pointof this post. Let's see what Lutz said about a week ago;




I can't find the word "disappear", or anything even remotely close to it, in that article. Never forget, this is one of the people who 30 or so years ago said that to meet CAFE standards we would all be driving something along the lines of what is now the Smart car. I think if you spent less time interpreting what is being said and espousing your opinion, and more time sticking to the facts, we'd all leave this thread a little smarter.

Now what were you saying about being bitten "on the bum"?

posted by  vwhobo

Being pedantic ain't gonna save you on this one. :wink2: Deconstructing and shooting holes in posts is dead easy, that's why I prefer providing thought provoking input, or plain tom foolery if the mood prevails.:mrgreen:

We all know that Lutz presides over the company and titular labels aside you will note that I used a lower case "P". My english may be off now and again, but I generally know the difference between a pronoun and noun. Of course I am probably wrong, but I think I can still sleep at nights. :wink2:

posted by  Wally

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