Now What¿

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Patience is a vurtue I dont have, so I've decided to buy either an rx-7 (G3), Mr-2 (90's), *Call me a hipacrit :banghead: * 3000GT (94+), supra (93+), S14, Eclipse (95-99), Or integra type-R........ Im thinkin rx-7 or MR2, I dont know much about the eclipse or the MR2's. Is it really worth the wait for an EVO or STi?? Dont get me wrong the integra is reliable but I really need a car with balls. What you guys think? :mrgreen:

posted by  jzxTT

since ur siding more with the rx7 and mr2, ill discard the rest.

ill say mr2, mainly cuz u will have problems with the rotary plant. ive done some research on those cars and have found wat mods they require and such.

they take a few bucks to modify, but not that much tbh, but they are definately worth it. the FD looks better, but the MR2 isnt a bad looking car at all (not to mention my favorite feature, a t-top).

GO TOYOTA! :P

posted by  Inygknok

If you want the best overall car and don't care about reliability go for the FC or FD turbo Rx-7. If you want a good car with good reliability get the MR-2.

posted by  thunderbird1100

Not too offend anyone but if you guys dont know anything about a car, dont comment. Knowledge based on hear-say just wount cut it. Unless you know of another sports car that can hit 150MPH on a daily basis redlines at 7500RPM , 12000 with porting, and can be bought for under $2000. Please inform me : ) RX7 are probally one of the most reliable sports cars out there, it all depends on how it was maintained. Its true that the first gens (FB's) were flawed and would blow seals like nobodys business. Most of the problems were solved in the 2nd gens (FC's). If youre intimadated by all the crap being thrown around by people that obviously dont know what they are talking about. Do some research on your own. If money is no object to you and you still like Rx7's then lookin into pettie racing banzai edition car its cost $50 000, it has 550HP, 460Lb torque 3 rotor, 2.0L twin turbo. btw it does 0-60 in 3.1 secs : )

anyways thats my 2 cents.....like i said above, this is not too offend anyone on here, but it seems like everyone on here are millionairs and have skylines as their beater cars..

posted by  Damien

is it me, or does everyone agree that this guy talks out of pure anal ignorance?

$50,000 for a damn FD? it better be carbon-fibre everywhere and have DVD's for that price.

also, for a 20B, 550hp is nuthin, thats the area where the 13B starts reaching its limits (unless u really push the engine really hard which wont last at all).

also buddy, about 7,500rpms, even an SR20DET can do that all day long. the MR-2? damn right it can do so as well, and oh, wait, its an iron block, which means u know it will resist a whole lotta crap u throw at it and leave it stock (classic american muscle cars anyone?).

also, the first RX to have ever really reached a level where it doesnt break down as much is the RX-8. the FC has cast iron seals that wear down the housing and eventually the rotors just float around.

also, EVERY SINGLE DAMN rotary engine owner has a spare engine on the side, just like the DSM owners, but even 2g DSMs outlast rotaries.

u know about the ceramic seals created by Franchesco Ianatti? sure, those can withstand high revs and nice levels of temperatures, but once they blow, its bye bye engine. ceramic shreds like the plates ur mom tells u to wash if u let them fall to the floor.

those hurley seals? they dont wear out the rotor as badly as the rest, but they dont last as long either.

aluminum filled carbon ones? just try using them on a turbo or nitrous car.

as for cast iron, well, its the best one in terms of the all-around resistant one, but it still wears down the rotor and they can score it if u abuse them.

u can ask any rotary engine owner about their info, and none of them will tell ya "just go buy stephan papadakis's special RX-7, it can whoop out less HP than u can actually make with the car and costs 3 times as much! and it doesnt even have a DVD!"

dont flatter urself. even i admit that Supras suck when it comes to terms of head gaskets and some serious stock cooling system problems. if u think we are all rich bastards, well, some of us work really damn hard for wat we have, i know i do. i dont have a dad and my mom is retired, and many of the other guys around here have had many cars cuz they have gotten far into their ages and have had to work really damn hard all of their lives.

twin turbo 20B putting out those numbers? try that with a single turbo 2JZ engine and leave the bottom end bone stock, in fact, just throw in an MHG with ARP headware since i can sure as bet that 20B has been prepped. that will make things fair. in fact, u want something even? 2G DSM putting out the same numbers, NOW we're even. both will break down rather soon, but i know the DSM will last longer.

posted by  Inygknok

My girlfriend's FD 94 Touring RX-7 just blew an apex seal the other day @ 92k miles. They are unreliable. Again i'll say this. My local shop has gone through 3 13bt-rew's in their race Datsun with apex seal issues (2mm and 3mm). These are mechanics we are talking about. They know how to maintain things more than anyone else. It's a common problem on all past rotary engines that are turbo induced. I was going to once buy a FC turbo 92 RX-7 for $1500 because it too had a blown motor (Apex Seal) @ 115k miles.

I love saying this : 13bt owners remind me of 7 bolt 4g63T owners. Most have backup engines if they are smart.

posted by  thunderbird1100

[QUOTE=Inygknok]is it me, or does everyone agree that this guy talks out of pure anal ignorance?

$50,000 for a damn FD? it better be carbon-fibre everywhere and have DVD's for that price.

also, for a 20B, 550hp is nuthin, thats the area where the 13B starts reaching its limits (unless u really push the engine really hard which wont last at all).

also buddy, about 7,500rpms, even an SR20DET can do that all day long. the MR-2? damn right it can do so as well, and oh, wait, its an iron block, which means u know it will resist a whole lotta crap u throw at it and leave it stock (classic american muscle cars anyone?).

also, the first RX to have ever really reached a level where it doesnt break down as much is the RX-8. the FC has cast iron seals that wear down the housing and eventually the rotors just float around.

also, EVERY SINGLE DAMN rotary engine owner has a spare engine on the side, just like the DSM owners, but even 2g DSMs outlast rotaries.

[QUOTE]

Finally something we can agree on. I vote he has never even owned or know a person who has owned a turbo rotary.

posted by  thunderbird1100

Not too offend anyone but if you guys dont know anything about a car, dont comment. Knowledge based on hear-say just wount cut it.

Good advice. Practice what you preach

Unless you know of another sports car that can hit 150MPH on a daily basis redlines at 7500RPM , 12000 with porting, and can be bought for under $2000. Please inform me : )

*Points to name* Need I say more? 12000 what with porting? I hope you're surley not suggesting the redline becomes 12000RPM with just porting?

RX7 are probally one of the most reliable sports cars out there, it all depends on how it was maintained. Its true that the first gens (FB's) were flawed and would blow seals like nobodys business.

Do us the favor and not contradict yourself. Flaws in gaskets and seals have nothing to do with the "maintainence" of a car. If its faulty its gonna blow, irregardless to how you treat the car.

Most of the problems were solved in the 2nd gens (FC's). If youre intimadated by all the crap being thrown around by people that obviously dont know what they are talking about. Do some research on your own. If money is no object to you and you still like Rx7's then lookin into pettie racing banzai edition car its cost $50 000, it has 550HP, 460Lb torque 3 rotor, 2.0L twin turbo. btw it does 0-60 in 3.1 secs : )

50,000 for an RX7? At ONLY 550HP? The acceleration is nice but for 50,000 it better drive itself.

anyways thats my 2 cents.....like i said above, this is not too offend anyone on here, but it seems like everyone on here are millionairs and have skylines as their beater cars
No, just a stupid assumption by you.


Pfft my ass. No DSM owner I know has an engine handy. If it locks it locks. You can have a 4G63 at your door in about 2 days. Hey I thought I told you about that crankwalk talk buddy :)

Haha look how you say it. It does'nt have a DVD. A DVD what? Are you referring to just a DVD disc, or just a DVD player? I think you're trying to refer the the visual setup of a DVD system(i.e. Plasma Screen and DVD player?) And those things are piss cheap where I'm at. Screen is about $300-800(depending on size) the player is $100-260.

*EDIT*
If you wan't the RX-7 then get it. You were leaning towards it, and you've stated only about as many times as I can remember that you want it. So get it, you don't even need our advice. Screw the MR2 get the RX-7.

posted by  DSMer

DVD as in a full blown cinema in there :P, including a popcorn machine.

posted by  Inygknok

Haha, popcorn machine. Something about boiling hot butter and driving at fast speeds does'nt mix very well.

Inygknok, you can get a full DVD cinema for a meager price compared to 50k large. I put one in my budos car. 15" flip down, 7 " in shotgun, and a 7" in the dash. All for about $1600. Then the underseat DVD player for $160, adapters for audio imput $200. Close to 2k if you know how to shop, so for 50k that car had better have navigation,dvd,rearview camers, and a full entourage of fuel management devices.

posted by  DSMer

I'd like to congratulate everyone here on a well thought out way of telling the smart mouthed newbie to shut his trap. Maybe he'll learn some respect for people here @ car-forums.com.... So anyways i was wondering how the hell ya'll know all this crap about so many different models of cars. Im just getting into the import world and i dont know crap. Anyone interesting in guiding a young individual?

posted by  VMJYogi

u n00b, dont u watch monster garage? pffft, jesse james owns u bitch! :laughing: :laughing:

lol anyhow, there was this one episode where he built a cop car with a donut making machine in there, even glazed them. it was pretty funny.

anyhow, ok.... ill think of more fancy luxury stuff... ooh, i know! for 50k, it better be the rotary version of KITT, and have modern controls but still the same voice.

posted by  Inygknok

Haha yeah, he needed it. VMJYogi, just read, drive, listen, and learn. Buying the occasional import magazine or google searching a car. Browsing forums, and even visiting the manufactuers website. Theres alot of information out there and alot of new cars and old cars that are still being researched. You're allready on the right foot by being a member of this forum. It takes time to learn. You'll get it one day.. I learned the whole concept of Horizontally Oppose,V,Inline,and Rotary engines by playing Tokyo Racing. Not to mention Naturaly Aspirated(N/A) and Forced Inductio(F/I). Its quite easy to learn alot of things once you understand how cars work.


N00b? How DARE YOU! :)
I watch monstergarage all the time and I find it amusing. Although I would hate to tear apart a perfectly good car to put a damn donut maker in it. Although that would be useful.... well maybe not but you get the idea...

posted by  DSMer

oh yeah the horizontally opposed/v/inline/boxer thing is easy. so is the whole na/turbo thing (got that from GT3). but i dont know about the different engines or car models. but ur right i haven't really tried to learn till now so yeah i'll probably get it sooner or later.

posted by  VMJYogi

Oh you mean how people know how like an eclipse has a 2.0L 4G63 I-4 in it? Or how a 6-Speed RX-8 has a Renesis 2 Rotary 238BHP? Just reading specs on cars. You'll get the hang of if..

posted by  DSMer

Too bad the 6port 6spd RX-8 has nowhere near 238 crank hp :( Dynos at a pathetic ~ 180-185rwhp (should be a 220 hp rating). There goes Mazda again, overrating their cars.

posted by  thunderbird1100

opps!

posted by  Unlicensed

roflmao :clap: I am very impressed!! that made my day here at work.

i read the previous post and was gearing up to take him on :cussing: and then scrolled down and saw i had absolutly no chance to say anything else! then scrolled down some more and :drool: DAMN! I dont wanna say anything now incase I get burnt too :oops: you guys get harsh on dem fools eh?

*high five hanging over here*

btw, was just gonna throw in the n/a QUAD rotor we got down here thats chucking out 470kw at the wheels :fu:

posted by  Unlicensed

No they won't flame you if you're wrong. But if you come in here "especially a newbie" claiming that everyone else is wrong and you think you're right. You'll get it nasty. Feel free to voice your opinion... just don't bash on everyone elses :thumbs: (Keep yer yapper shut Inygknok, I allready feel a side comment :) )

posted by  DSMer

Yeah, i think you guys scared him off. hahahah :orglaugh: To answer for the original question, i would go with the MR2, its more reliable. And its a well-balanced car. Probaly get better times then the RX-7 with very few mods. Since its rear mounted motor. The MR2 is great for drifting as well, most rear mounted motor with RWD are. Ive seen quite a few of busted up seals in RX-7's, not pretty, not pretty at all. You know what is weird? The DSM and the Evo use the same basic engine the 4G63. Yet the one in the EVo is so much better. They must save the best parts for the better car. ahah.

posted by  aerith

Acually this really changed my mind about an rx-7. Shit..... what about a supra. (SinceIve never owned one i would'nt know how they drive), or a 3000GT....... Or would it be better to wait for an.......Evo/Sti :banghead: I dought Ill be disapointed if I wait. But then again...........

posted by  jzxTT

I'll save me and you the trouble and just say that no 4G63 is bad. It is THE greatest,most powerful I-4 block to date. Oh, and I'm not being big headed. You say the Evo's 4G63 is better, and I'm assuming that you base this on factory HP wich is 280HP where as the DSM's 4G63 is 190HP. More research and products have gone in to the 91-94 blocks than the newer 98-04 blocks.

If you think a Evo is "better" than a DSM(1g), you've got a surprise coming. Its been almost 12 years since the Evo was introduced and almost 15 since the 1st generation of DSM's came out. The Evo has always had about 20-60HP more than the Eclipse 1g, similar AWD, and if I'm not mistaken a lighter body. Yet still a 1gDSM(made almost over 15 years ago) can beat any generation of evo that is willing to step to the staging lights...

(1/4 8.769 @ 165.970) This is the fastest DSM from JShepard racing. 91 GSX, and no thats not a top fuel dragster.. Insanley rediculous..

Simon Norris(aka EvoBoy) no longer owns the fastest Evolution. RC Developments have created a 930BHP Lancer EVO VII ran a 9.9 1/4rth @ 140? run..at a strip.

Now you tell me that the Evo is better... The 1g DSM is a legend. Not even the CRD Supra could touch it. One turbo and 4 cylinders, quarter of a mile in 8.7 seconds...., need I say more?

posted by  DSMer

george iounnus and his street glow solara would have a few words to say :P (yea i know, its a dragster).


anyhow, krap, so many people replied while i slept.


jzxtt
ofc ill tell u to get a supra if u can, ITS ME FFS!!! :laughing:


DSMer
true, the 4g63 is the best 4 banger so far, and closely behind would have to be the SR20DET. the sr20 has less years in production, but it has still been proven to be a really strong engine..... if only it had an iron block.... oh and, i dont think jesse james cares if the car is new or old.... he already destroyed the brand new Magnum and quite a few old cars, not to mention both of his Mazda car episodes failed (an fc3s and a Miata).


VMJYogi
ive learned since i have been taught from an early age.... so i kinda got used to learning those things fast and started analyzing without even thinking. give it some time, u will learn. this kid im teaching, hes only 15 and he is one of the very slow ones, and he has learned quite alot in just the few months i have been teaching him (compared to the other morons i have to teach).



and as for the newbie that came in here yapping his mouth... its his own fault. if me n dsmer hadnt scared him away, jzxtt and sundown would have done it before us, followed by bav and then chrisv would have finished him off :laughing:

posted by  Inygknok

Supra - eh, bad idea. Unless of course you have an unlimited budget. A Mk4 TT Supra will cost you upwards of $20k to buy. Then while it will only be a mid 13 second car to start modding it you will need to spend even MORE money than all the other aforementioned cars. Mk4 TT Supras are money pits and are for just 'appeal'.

3000GT I don't recommend simply because they are extremely too heavy (3760+lbs for the VR-4). They are best suited for touring and not sports nor dragging. Plus some had tranny problems.

Evo I would definatley give the thumbs up for. Excellent car with one of the strongest stock engines i've seen (people are easily putting down 400+awhp on a totally stock internaled engine).

STi isnt my cup of tea. It doesnt handle very well (obviously tuned mroe towards the off-roader with it's loose shock rate) compared to the EVO but is a demon in a straight line. Straight lines are boring to me, but they may not be to you.

My ultimate choice - 90-95 300ZXTT. Have you looked into those at all? They weigh around what a Mk4 TT Supra does (and less than some versions of the Supra). They easily do mid 13 second 1/4 miles (like the Supra). They also handle pretty well stock with the rubber they wear (225 up front 245 in the rear). Best thing is among the cars mentioned you can probably get that one as one of the cheapest. Around $10k for one with decent mileage. Best thing is they are A LOT cheaper to mod than the Supra. You can check out Z1motorsports for some ideas and stuff.

Think of it this way you can get a 95 TT Supra with 320hp weighs anywhere from 3525lbs-3600+lbs and does mid 13 second 1/4 miles for $20k. Or you could get the 300zxtt for $10k weighs a tick over 3500lbs has 300hp and also does mid 13 second 1/4 miles. Let's think here. How much better could you make the 300zxtt with $10k in mods to match the price of the STOCK Supra? Let's throw about $3500 in to suspension and wheels/tires (should cover a good coilover setup with all new sway/strut bars...also a good set of 18x8/18x10 wheels with 245 and 275 rubber). With that it should handle like a dream. Should be pulling well over a G on the skidpad and be doing 72-73ish mph slalom runs if not better. Now with $6500 in the engine you could easily get a FULL turboback exhaust with a downpipe/testpipes/exhaust-back for $1000...now for $1500 you get all new pistons/rods (forged). For $4000 now you can easily upgrade the fuel injectors and pump (around $700) change out the turbos to bigger units with a better IC (around $2000)...add in a good controller ($300)..all new intake piping ($200)...new clutch and 1 piece steel driveshaft ($500-$600). Now with all that and your $200 left-over spend as track money at the 1/4 mile and road course/auto-x. With those mods you should be able to handle with anything and also be putting down somewhere in the region of 400-500rwhp if not more. Should be good for mid 11s if not better. now let's race that lonely stock Supra :)

posted by  thunderbird1100

You let them scare you away from an RX-7? Dayum, see what you guys did, talking all crazy about seals blowing... If it were my position, I would probably have the seals replaced way before they even thought about blowing. Thats what you do with late model DSM's. Replace all the stuff that tends to go first before it actually does.

But what people here seem to not know or they don't show that they do know it, is that you don't go modding on a 10yr old car. They must not know very much about tuning because if the motor is 10yrs old serious problems can and tend to occur when you go sticking shit on to it. This one guy is talking about fuel injectors etc.. blah blah blah and running 11's. 11's are no good if your grandpa motor blows a head gasket. Wich could be the result of you "upgrading" all of that stuff he listed

If you're anything serious about buying and older car to fix it up, any one you go with should have a full motor inspection if not a rebuild. Epsecially if it has alot of miles. No telling who went slapping things onto the motor before you had it, and from the looks of it alot of people do. If you wanted to wait to buy an Evo or STi you would most likely be sastified with either car. With the Supra and or the 3OOZX, it would also be in your best interest to have the motor fully inspected,compression tested, rebuilt, etc.. IF you're planning on adding serious performance upgrades to the car.

The RX-7 is'nt a bad choice. Non of them are. But seeing as that you wanted an RX-7 far before you even considered the others, I would say stick to your original choice iregardless of what problems "can" occur. If you do things right the first time you won't have to worry about them coming back to bite you in the ass, because in the automotive world lazy people tend to do things twice.

posted by  DSMer

While im a big fan of a 1g DSM still the 6 bolt motor won't take as much power in stock internaled form as the new 4g63T in the EVO 8. You could get rid of the 1g pistons for the 2g pistons and come a bit closer, but still wouldn't be there. I've seen stock internaled Evo's lay down over 400awhp..best 1g AWD DSM's can do and be reliable with stock internals is in the mid 300's. Also I think you're kind of yin-yanging around. The Evo was built for semi-offroading and excellent handling. The 1g DSM was built for more of a straight line. If someone REALLY made a hard attempt like Shepherd at an Evo they could do 8's pretty easily. Let me get this right too, you are claiming a STOCK 1g AWD DSM can beat any STOCK Evo I-VIII? Are you kidding or did you mis-word something...all Evo's did 13 second 1/4 miles. Best a FWD or AWD turbo DSM could do was low low 15s (with MAYBE a high 14 here and there). The Evo is much better platform wise for handling. The DSM Eclipse/Talon/Laser is much better platform wise for dragging. Simple clause.

Also were you kidding again about 'no 4g63T was bad'? Because the 7 bolt motors were crankwalk KINGS...I don't know of one surviving 7 bolt 4g63T that hasn't experienced crankwalk.

posted by  thunderbird1100

Typical coming from a DSM person. 'You can fix it, over and over and over'. Even having the seals replaced doesn't guarentee anything. Like I said i've seen a drag car go through 3 13bt-rew's with seal problems...tried everything they could to fix it. Wouldn't work.

posted by  thunderbird1100

I've already had a Z http://memimage.cardomain.com/member_images/1/web/301000-301999/301078_15_f ull.jpg
After selling it and buying an integra I sorta miss 600hp. So im looking to mod heavy.

posted by  jzxTT

While im a big fan of a 1g DSM still the 6 bolt motor won't take as much power in stock internaled form as the new 4g63T in the EVO 8. You could get rid of the 1g pistons for the 2g pistons and come a bit closer, but still wouldn't be there.
True, but we're talking about 15 years of technilogical advancments here. Better blocks, ecu's, etc.. But I'm not going to base this off of stock internal HP

I've seen stock internaled Evo's lay down over 400awhp..best 1g AWD DSM's can do and be reliable with stock internals is in the mid 300's.
Meh, this is pretty accurate. Although I have seen guys push 450's on stock internals. If you're going to judge the engine you can't use AWHP that applys to more to the car.

Also I think you're kind of yin-yanging around. The Evo was built for semi-offroading and excellent handling. The 1g DSM was built for more of a straight line. If someone REALLY made a hard attempt like Shepherd at an Evo they could do 8's pretty easily.
I'm not sure of the DSM being built for drag racing purposes(as it is very good at autocross and does have an AWD chassis) but many people have tried with Evo's to reach low ET times but never have sucessfully gotten anywhere under 9.5(this includes big companys)

Let me get this right too, you are claiming a STOCK 1g AWD DSM can beat any STOCK Evo I-VIII? Are you kidding or did you mis-word something...all Evo's did 13 second 1/4 miles. Best a FWD or AWD turbo DSM could do was low low 15s (with MAYBE a high 14 here and there).
No not stock, the average DSM.. Although there are alot of cases where guys with Stock AWD DSM's are doing 13.5's I have a buddy in LA who owns a TSI AWD 92. I still can't seem to figure out how he can run 12.9's in his stock car. No Intake, not 1 added engine component. He claims its the weight reduction and vaccum lines he messed with but shaving off over 1-2 second ET's? I'v checked his block and its all stock.

The Evo is much better platform wise for handling. The DSM Eclipse/Talon/Laser is much better platform wise for dragging. Simple clause.
Could'nt agree more.

Also were you kidding again about 'no 4g63T was bad'? Because the 7 bolt motors were crankwalk KINGS...I don't know of one surviving 7 bolt 4g63T that hasn't experienced crankwalk.
Haha, stop saying that. Not all 7 bolt motors crank walk. The 95-96 7 bolts just have a really extreme chance for crank walk. I know plenty of guys running on 98, 99 even 97's that have yet to crankwalk

Typical coming from a DSM person. 'You can fix it, over and over and over'. Even having the seals replaced doesn't guarentee anything. Like I said i've seen a drag car go through 3 13bt-rew's with seal problems...tried everything they could to fix it. Wouldn't work.
Nothing is a guarantee when you're working with car engines. He could just as easily blow the head gasket on a Supra or 300ZX. You should'nt chase him away from the car that he really wants because a few people have seal problems. It might not be 100% fullproof, but either way if hes going to heavily mod the engine is going to have to be inspected and most likely rebuilt. So why not go with the RX-7 and possibly prevent the problem, since hes going to be modding the engine anyways? I don't hear anyone talking about the valve stem seals that go bad on the Supra or the alignment problems that do tend to occur. Each car to its own, has problems. So we can't rule out the rx-7 because a few of them have faulty seals

posted by  DSMer

DSMer has to be the perfect replacement for vwhobo. "all cars have their own problems".... thats true, like the 300zx's timing belt *which is a bÿtch to replace due to space in the engine bay :banghead: *. So rx-7 is basically a high mantinence car. I can deal with that..... Since that what I was aiming for. So lets say its RX-7 vs. MR2.... which is the way to go? *keep in mind that im 6'1 so would fitting in an MR2 be a problem*? :mrgreen:

posted by  jzxTT

ive had problems fitting myself in the old MR-2's.... i fit quite well in the 2nd gen ones, abit tight but im 6'4. as for the supra, i dont know where the hell u guys live but i can get one for way under $20k over here.


as for the RX-7, yup, high maintainance car. no doubt about it. also, supras dont take that much money to mod, depending on wat the hell u do to them.

twins = $$$$
single turbo = $

simple math, eh?

u can just give them a new MHG, ARP headware, clutch, and single turbo set up, and that wont cost much cuz u can sell your old equipment (wow, thats so hard to do, eh?).

posted by  Inygknok

Who little old me? No I've read some of his post and I can only work and hope to be as knowledgeable as the vwhobo. The MR2 is a very reliable car, but do to its MR chassis, it may be a little difficult to control. Thats just one downside to it. Its very cheap and easy to upgrade. It could be considered the civic of toyota. Although I think a person of your stature would be very pleased with the RX-7. I'm assuming you're looking for a challenge to work on. The RX-7 is a high maintanence car, but the pride and respect that comes with owning one is well worth it. Not everyone has RX-7's for the simple fact that it is a high priority maintanence car to work with, but if you're up to the challenge RX-7 should suite you fine.

posted by  DSMer

A challenge and a headache are two different things. But im up for either one..... Alright looks like project RX-7 has just started. THanks mr.DSMer :thumbs:

posted by  jzxTT

Haha when has any car ever NOT given you a headahce? I just wanted you to stick with your original idea. I hope the RX-7 works out for you good, just when you buy it make SURE you get it inspected by a local ASE, if not a very good Mazda specialist. I can't stress the importance of this. It helps..

posted by  DSMer

http://www.hockin.org/~itoen/rx7/silver/exterior/CIMG1057.JPG
pick it up wednesday. :drool: 10 thousand $$$.

posted by  jzxTT

Why did you get rid of the Z?

posted by  thunderbird1100

I have to draw the line there. Some cars have more problems than others. Some cars have more SEVERE problems than others. The Rx-7 has got to be the most unreliable of the cars so-far in discussion. I know a lot of turbo RX-7 owners (many have backup 13b's) and most have had problems with their engine one way or another (probably would say 75% apex seal related)...they all say they love car but hate it's reliability, but it's something they are willing to put up with. You can't EVER completely prevent something from happening to your engine. You can HELP reduce the risk of it happening. But never prevent it. My Girlfriend just blew an apex seal on her 94 RX-7 the other day. I was expecting it. So now we will just lay down $4500 for a 20b :) Time to port that SOB (among other things) and see 500hp.

posted by  thunderbird1100

I hear you on the engine bay space on the Z....I hate it. I'm a big guy too, 6'5 240. It's a Biotch.

posted by  thunderbird1100

because Im stupid.

posted by  jzxTT

You can find a mk4 TT Supra for UNDER $20k? Lies Lies Lies. Only mk4 Supra you will find for under $20k around me are the N/A POS ones (and they still cost $15k).

http://www.autotrader.com/findacar/results.jtmpl?model=SUPRA&start_year=199 3&end_year=1998&min_price=&max_price=&distance=50&advanced=y&advcd_on=n&mak e=TOYOTA&address=30281&search_type=used&x=36&y=4

That's within a 50 mile radius of me. Cheapest is above $23k. So much for finding TT Supras for under $20k.

Supras are CHEAP to mod? WTF - Do you know anything about Supras and their parts? Everything is more expensive for them than your average car. Exhausts are a grand etc...Also one thing the Supra sucks at is dragging, They suck at launches and i've seen SOOO many bog down with 600-700hp and run mid-high 12s. People invest about $10k-$15k to get there too (from a general synopsis). Mk4 TT Supras = only one thing...Moneypit.

posted by  thunderbird1100

D'oH :banghead:

posted by  thunderbird1100

He KNOWS what he's talking about. He's got a Supra MKIII.

posted by  abless

I don't care if he's 'gota Hemi'. He doesnt know what he's talking about saying you can find mk4 TT Supras for 'well' under $20k in decent condition. Did you NOT look at the link I posted. Cheapest one within 50 miles of me is $23+k (Average price was in the mid-upper $20k's). For a Mk4 TT Supra to be under $20k the car has to have 200k miles on it, it be in a police auction from a drug bust or it having been in a bad crash.

posted by  thunderbird1100

i am so sick of your damn bullcrap already.... do u know how many times ive gone around looking for a twin turbo one on sale and found them and test driven them? more than i could count on my bit drunken state atm. i honestly can not say how damn much ive focused myself on these damn cars. i think my obsession with them shows.

my mechanic has owned 4 of them. down at the speedshop we have 14 (or so) clients with twin turbo supras, and quite a few with my very same one. one of them even has a damn 1jz (very rare on the island). things work differently down here.

we have a saying that goes (its in spanish but ill translate it): "Give a Boricua $5,000 and he will build you an 11 second car being slow. Give an American $20,000 and he will build you an 11 second car using AWD."

one of the MK4's i was close to buying had 70k miles on it and had just been rebuilt for no apparent reason. it wasnt actually a rebuild, the guy just felt like doing a complete tune up after changing the timing belt. he offered it to me for just $18,000, and would throw in some extra rims with tires for $1,500 more. i didnt buy it cuz i didnt have the money at the time.

thing is, dont criticize people n tell them wat they talk is bullshit, specially if u dont know how things work in other areas, cuz u will just be making an ass out of urself. also, no, modding a supra is not expensive. if u want, u can go ahead and buy forged pistons and just go out, but its not needed. its a well known factor that supras can handle things just fine with stock engines. give them an MHG ($120-$250), ARP headware ($120), and improve the cooling (I/C - $1,200, Radiator - $400, dual electric fans with thermostat - $200), plus exhaust ($600 if u wanna buy a greddy one or some other expensive aftermarket one, maybe more sometimes), and ur set.

down here we dont do things like that. we know wat being "cost efficient" is. its just like DSM's, just throw $2,000 at them and they can run 11's all day long, even if they break.

right now im looking at around $2,500 in mods for my own car, n thats not discounting the parts i will sell, and it includes the machine shop and labor for some things. my mech had one of my very same ones with around 440rwhp (he cant find his dynographs), and could pull 11's all day long on street tires. bought some radials and managed 10's. his 2jz? the engine cost him $4,000 including shipping and handling and the trans. wat cost him so much about the 2jz-rolla was all the work he went through getting that thing in there and the custom work he had to do, but he spent no more than $5,000 on that, including some aftermarket mods (radiator, driveshaft, I/C, etc.).

also, if u find modding supras expensive, then u just dont know how to look for parts at all. HKS and GReddy arent the answer to all of your modding questions. do some research before u do some yapping.

how do i know that u just yapper yap? simple, just seeing the way that u accuse all the 4g63's of having crankwalk issues. i do it as a way of joking. u just say it for the heck of it. i believe this is called "talking out of your ass".

posted by  Inygknok

what the hell is a dsm? are you talking about mitsy gsr? 1.8 Turbo awd?

i sell those to school girls as a first car!

posted by  Unlicensed

:banana: (LoOks LiKe I cant enjoy my :pop:)

posted by  jzxTT

..........

another one talking without knowing a thing.....

first of all, 4G63's = 2.0 liters

second of all, DSM's are the Talons, Eclipses, and Lasers that were produced in some same plant by Diamond Star Motors (hence the DSM). they consist of both, FWD models and AWD models, not just AWD.

posted by  Inygknok

first off, its a 4g93! and I think i do know what I'm talking about cuase I sell them every week! :banghead:

I simply asked what a dsm was? and was it "a 1.8 lancer turbo awd" as they are here in nz where we get all the japanise imports!

so this follows your hasty jump on the aggro band wagon :fu:

we dont get the lancer with a turbo and no awd! just doesn't happen!

do you really need pics as proof? or are you just happy to get on with your lives? (probably not)

posted by  Unlicensed

WOAH, calm down boys. Lets not get dirty and wrestle. You are both correct.

DSM: Diamond Star Motors. They produced the 1rst generation(89-94) of Eagle Talon/Mitsubishi Eclipse/Plymoth Laser and the 2nd generation(95-99) of Eagle Talons and Mitsubishi Eclipse.

While the DSM is commonly associated with the 4G63T(2.0L DOHC@195BHP) the lower base models of DSM came with the 4G93(1.8L SOHC@93BHP) or the 4G63(2.0DOHC@135BHP).

Mitsubishi Eclipse:
Base-4G93(FWD)
RS/GS-4G63(FWD)
GS-T-4G63T(FWD)
GSX-4G63T(AWD)

Eagle Talon:
DL-4G93(FWD)
ES-4G93(FWD)
ESi-4G93/4G63(FWD)
TSi-4G63T(FWD/AWD)

Plymoth Laser:
Base-4G93(FWD)
RS-4G63/4G63T(FWD/AWD)

Ok boys so more fighting. That should explain all :thumbs:

posted by  DSMer

I see what the deal is. You live in Puerto Rico where EVERYTHING is cheaper. Welcome to the U.S. where you won't find ANYTHING cheap in the major cities. People are getting $3000-$4000 for 90 CRX's around me. They amy-be cheap where you live (under $20k USD) but certainly not around major U.S. cities.

BTW - I never said "all 4g63T's crankwalk". If you had paid attention I said only the 7 BOLT motors were more prone to crankwalking (i.e. 2nd gen DSMs). Best you comprehend before you yibber yabber and trash someone for something they never said. :screwy:

posted by  thunderbird1100

Another one correcting like he knows everything. :laughing:

posted by  thunderbird1100

Don't forget good 'ole chrysler's crap engine they offered. The 420a.

posted by  thunderbird1100

$3k-$4k for a little CRX? thats the cost of one with a B16 engine in them and in really good shape over here. btw, a cousin of mine lived in new york and in florida for quite a while and still managed to prep his car just fine. i cant remember exactly wat it was atm since quite a few of my cousins have had many cars.

my mech has ordered parts from the US and still manages a low budget just fine. all in all, its the person him/herself that needs to learn how to look for parts and things. autotrader is not going to save ur life every single day for all of ur necessities.

as for the other comment u said, just read at wat u have said about the crankwalks issues and how u have no idea about how to look for parts in an economical manner (best bang for your buck theory).

posted by  Inygknok

I never find ANY Supra's listed in the classified's around me. Only good place TO look is autotrader (where you can search within your given area). Most people list their car on autotrader now. I've shopped around for Supra's before. Was actually going to get one. Then I started searching around and seeing how much they were and also how much parts were for them. Too much $$$. Then I looked at the mk III and just thought it was too hideous. I actually offered a guy $16,500 for his 94 mk IV TT Supra w/94k miles on it. He laughed at the offer turned around and sold it for $24,600. That was about a year or so ago.
Again, I said 7 bolt motors, never said ONE THING about the 6 bolt motors crankwalking. Read Again.

posted by  thunderbird1100

I guess its always best to compare apples with apples don't ya think?

right well, thank you dsmer. dsm = mitstubishi or mmc as I also know them.

these 2.0lt turbo fwd must be built in the us as they aren't available from japan. Only non turbos have the fwd here. And to get 4g63T in anything is usually called an evo here. only found in lancer and old galant vr-4s (evo 0). the lancer gsr has the 4g93 with dohc turbo on current models btw.

Thanks again for the info I was looking for DSMer :thumbs:


edit: mmmmm! i just done a search on your dsm eclipse and am gutted! you get that car with a 4g63T! might be worth me importing one over here i think? see how long it takes to sell!

posted by  Unlicensed

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