Most successful euro company?

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I believe the germans have the most successful car company(s).

But there are companies form other countries such as sweden(if not sweden, then one of the norweigen nations), france, Great Britain, i think Italy...any others?

How successful are the other car manufactuers of Europe?

posted by  DragonMaster

Goes like this
1. Germany
2. France
3. UK
4. Sweden
5. Italy
Most of UK's and Sweden's car companys are now owned by Ford or GM.
But the brits still have TVR, Noble, Morgan, MG-Rover, Radical, Westfield, Ariel, Caterham, Bristol and Mercos.
The Swedes now only have Koenigsegg :ohcrap:

posted by  Car Nirvana

you would be unbelivably WRONG. ever hear of the Americans? it seems not. They spank all the other european companies in terms of money made. besides, what's the criteria for "most successful"? most money made? best client base? best rearview mirrors? we need specifics, and people like Car Nirvana need to stop spewing bullshit like the above post. :banghead:

posted by  SuperJew

obviously rick james did not notice the term "Euro" used in the question, which usually refers to cars manufactured in European countries. (fyi america isn't in europe)

-super

posted by  SuperTad

oops. :oops: but even so, forget about the america part - whats your criteria?

posted by  SuperJew

He is right tho...lots of car companies in the European Area are owned by American companies...but I dont know tons about companies in Europe becuase I live in America...but from what I can tell the Germans have got probably the most...consumers... (not including Asian and American Companies...obviously) :2cents:

posted by  StiMan

Typical, full of your self !
As for the criteria i assumed DragonMaster ment profit.
You think you know so much why dont you tell us !!! :fu:

posted by  Car Nirvana

It is good to see a new, controlled noob...o never mind...
Everytime you flick off a friend you got 2000+ going back at u! :fu:

posted by  StiMan

What do you expect when he says my post is bullshit ?

posted by  Car Nirvana

Well...if I made the mistake he did I would have done the same thing...he apologised so you blew him up...good idea! :screwy:

posted by  StiMan

what i found bullshit about your post is that there is simply no way to say which is most successful. what is successful? if you're talking about overpriced cars, yes, the Germans win. but what about safety? the Swedes own everybody in the WORLD. and even so, there is no "most successful" car company. if there was then we'd all be driving it, and it would monopolize the industry.

thank you, and have a nice day. :fu:

posted by  SuperJew

Ya what he said Mr. Car Nirvana...
I believe you should pimp slap him...but thats just me...
:fu: Car Nirvana

posted by  StiMan

Frankly, no one gives a damn.

posted by  DodgeRida67

"Frankly no one gives a damn"

well i do, im interested in pointless facts, which really may not be too pointless if ur in the buisnees world of cars manufacturing:) But im not, just want to know the statistics.

Sorry for the very general term successful, really intended to know which company sells the most cars. Simply which company sells the most....well actually maybe profits can be tied in there. A mix of sells most number of cars and most profit made. Im not concerned with with which company has been most succesful in producing the saftest car. But that sounds interesting....which car companies have been most succesful in producing safe cars?

Sounds like its the swedish Koenigsegg(no clue how to pronouce it :mrgreen: ) that are most successful in this area. But then why is this? Couldnt americans or the Japanese produce safer cars then sweden? My initial thought why this is so is becouse maybe Koenigsegg uses pours in more resouces(money, work force) into safty for making a big selling point to compete agaisnt he other larger car companies around the globe.

posted by  DragonMaster

On whos rating system? The US Govement's, Japan's, or Sweden's? In other words, you can take a car from Sweden and by there safety ratings, be blown off the charts. At the same time, bring that car to the US and by our standards be total crap and not safe to jack up quickly.


I wish someone could give me a comparative on the standard differences between the countries and their goverments because I'm lost there :ohcrap:

posted by  DodgeRida67

What happened to your "New, good member" thing?

posted by  StiMan

yeah i was going to say "have a nice pimp slapping" and then nailed him but the smiley creator thing wasn't working. :cussing:

and its still not working.... :cussing:

posted by  SuperJew

No there is no apologie in his post..... LOOK


As I said I assumed DragonMaster ment profit.
As for all the pimp slapping stuff your very sad !! :screwy:

posted by  Car Nirvana

what an amusing thread! so far everyone has only bitched to each other and disputed what the damn question means.

why don't you do all the viewers a favor and stop throwing pussy insults and answer the goddamn question

:cussing: :fu: :banghead: :doh:


:thumbs:

posted by  SuperTad

Let's see here. You claim were all bitching at each other. You post and bitch. OK. You asked why don't we stop bitching and answer the question. Why didnt you? OK. You did the very thing you told us not to do. Wow, n00bs :screwy:




Someone has to be an @$$hole around here.

posted by  DodgeRida67

Who ?

posted by  Car Nirvana

yeah he actually is right, i never did apologise.



you are a n00b. you wouldn't understand.

posted by  SuperJew

As for all the n00b stuff your very sad :thumbs:

posted by  Car Nirvana

Ok, here's how it works...you have to agree with me if I make a mistake, but I dont have to agree with you if you make a mistake..comprende?...Ok, now we have that one sorted, I'll continue, I believe that Volvo is the most seccessfull car manufacturer due to sales figures, or atleast that's how it was a year or two ago. Anyway, due to the 'widespread' meaning of the word 'successfull', I'd have to say that BMW are the thee most successfull European manufacturer these days. As for any Rover branded vehicles..... :banghead: <<

posted by  Cliffy

why no, i'm quite happy now. but thanks for asking.

posted by  SuperJew

Lemme see....humm....ok
Dodge is the new a*s
SJ cant pimp slap anymore
Tad gets angry fast
and
Car Nirvana is a noob

...got it! :thumbs:

posted by  StiMan

http://www.smiliegenerator.de/s24/smilies-619.png

shut the f*ck up, StiMan. pimp slap is back!! :thumbs:

posted by  SuperJew

Me, of course.

Nice to see you like the O.C SJ. It's awesome is'nt it? Anyway, I love it. :clap:

posted by  DodgeRida67

Well for arguements sake, I will say that Dacia is the most successful European company. I mean can you really beat a Romanian automobile?!?!?!?!? Anyways they were lucky enough to get Renault to commit to invest over $300 million in Dacia. (lol Romania has cars.... I thought they needed electricity first)

posted by  Voda48

yeah dude, OC kicks ass. you hear about a Season 1 DVD at all? i'd go for that in a heartbeat.

posted by  SuperJew

Sorry if this is gonna be a little off topic, but Q1:which euro companies do you guys think will have a brighter near future? (In terms of sales).

Personaly I think Audi will finally get the success it deserves. It's been making very good cars in the mid-late '90s yet most ppl bought BMWs and Benzes instead just for 'the name'. Q2: Do you guys think this is changing lately?

ps. Is vhooboo gone? :ohcrap: I had much respect for this guy (as did many of u) it's sad.
R.I.P vhooboo. jk

posted by  GMC8100

A1: well, french builders have always been at the top of the ranking with VW. New Renault Mégane II is a good product and it's being sold very well (at least in Spain), in spite of its horrible back end.

A2: I don't know what do you refer to. If you mean that people will consider Audi as good as MB or BMW you are right. In fact new Audis are pretty and now they are differentiated from VW and Seat.

Respuesta 1: Bueno, los constructores franceses siempre han estado en lo más alto del ranking junto con VW. El nuevo Renault Mégane II es un buen producto y se está vendiendo muy bien (al menos es España), a pesar de su horrible trasera.

Respuesta 2: No sé a qué te refieres. Si te refieres a que la gente considerará a Audi tan buena como MB o BMW estás en lo cierto. De hecho, los nuevos Audi son bonitos y ahora están diferenciados de los VW y los Seat.

posted by  karburator

YAY!!! I wanted to see that! Now as to weither or not the pimp slap was a direct insult to me... I dont really know... but it is good to have it back! :thumbs:

posted by  StiMan

nah i was just showing you it was back. you didnt get pimp slapped. :thumbs:

posted by  SuperJew

Ahh.. good... that happened I think just once... but it was back in the thread in which I was put on probation :oops: .... good that it wasnt to me.! :thumbs:

posted by  StiMan

Well, as Europe has standardised test for the whole 25 nations were the largest trading block as of last week.

I work for a materials company specialising in balistic protection, we were working with jag thinking about making a armoured S type to compete with the BMW 5 series Protection. He was saying that they have alsorts of problems trying to build the thing in the first place because its based on the lincoln towncar can they couldnt get it to meet more stringent euro crash tests which takes into account pedestrian saftey, and they have to meet rollover and stability targets. Which is why as soon as the stability targets were brought in you couldnt buy a ford explorer for 2 years until they worked out a way to stop it behaving like a washing machine in a spin cycle if you swerve at 40mph.

I think we have to say its horses for courses. American desgined cars work well in the us, and euro ones work well in Europe. very diffrent rd structure. I have never found a round about in the usa as yet. Ive never found a rd long enough in a euro town or city to acomadate the stoplight sytem that the usa uses. I think you americans have to remeber that in terms of population density its a very diffrent ball game over here. Here in jolly old blighty we have ten times more people per sq mile.

60 million in a state the size of oregan. Theres only 280 million of you in the entire 50 states.

posted by  cinqyg

Listen UP.


Us brits have been some what shaged by our goverment in the 70's on the mass manufacture game. You have to admid you americans really coulndt get enough of our sports cars until then. Were still very good at sports cars. Why are most of the F1, rally, touring car, 4x4, teams based here. As you look at the list of british manufacutres you will find that they are mainly into sports cars.

We have
Ariel
Westfield
Lotus
MG
Ultima
Tiger
MacLaren
Reliant- before you guys take the piss think about the Scimitar, first perfomace estate.
Jaguar race team (people who made the XJ220)
the japs are very good at designing engines but they come here to work on suspention and styleing
Fords GT suspesion and floor pan was designed by guys workin for jag in coventry and the origional GT40 was a Colin Chapman (lotus) desgin. All cuz enzo and henry had a lovers tiff.
Pilgrim
NG
Aston Martin, May be owned by ford but it makes proper britsh aports cars justlike it has for 80 years
Jensen
Marcos
Ginetta
noble
triumph
TVR- its a TreVoR if people didnt already know
We may not all the companies that origionated here. But if we were all acountants then we would be on public transport because it makes best use of availble resorces. We are good at High performace engineering. Germans are good at making very reliable cars, just like the japs.

So lets all have a VW polo or Nissan micra in the week and drive a TVR at the weekend. :mrgreen:

posted by  cinqyg

yeah cinqyg, roundabouts are quite rare in the USA. there's maybe 2 or 3 in my whole area. i've noticed Massachussetts has a good amount.

posted by  SuperJew

This is going to sound out-of-place, but Iowa City being the sprawling metropolis that it is has three roundabouts :screwy:

posted by  Voda48

is Iowa City a metropolis? i dunno... :ohcrap:

posted by  SuperJew

Sure it is....... :screwy:
IC is not even close. I mean you can drive less than five minutes and end up in a corn field. It is a decent college campus, but I think the population here is like 60,000. (that number includes Bessy the cow and her other bovine friends)

posted by  Voda48

i see....

i think my Neon came from Iowa City....yeah it did. thats creepy. :soul:

posted by  SuperJew

The ones I know of:
Lotus: Owned by Ford or Chevy cant remember which... it is with Vauxhall in that
MG: the newest one I know of in the US is 20 yrs old.
MacLaren: Aint the quickest stock car anymore... not interested
Jaguar: owned by Ford
Ford GT: I could car less
Aston Martin: owned by Ford
Noble: not here
Triumph: maybe a cycle or two over here...
TVR: Not over here
Ya... not interested...
I have heard that most english cars are not reliable... is that true?

posted by  StiMan

Yes, that's very true. Here's a prime example, Rover's K-Series engine, all of them, from 1.4litre - 2.0litre were probably the most unreliable engine ever. The really strange thing is, that these engines were one of the most comonly used units, I mean, they were used in all Rover branded cars from the early '90's through to the present day. They were used in the Rover 200 - 800 series and all new models for exampl, the Rover 25 - 75, Land Rover Freelander, Lotus Elise (Euro spec only), Lotus or Caterham7's and some Aerial Atom's..oh, and Westfields too. There were probably loads more, I just cant think right now. Anyway, my point is, that these engines are sooo unreliable, It has been known to suffer head gasket problems from as early on as 10,000 miles and over heating is also a big issue (often the reason, but not always, for head gasket failer). So, that's Rovers for ya (and also why I hate them lol). TVR are also very unreliable cars :banghead:

posted by  Cliffy

well MG is back in the usa, lotus is actually owned by proton, they just make the VX220, which is a GM creation, well not really true, they just paid for lotus to create it.

I think we are missin the point here in terms of sports cars. a proper sports car you shouldnt drive it to work or take it shopping, it should be about the pursute of pleasure. if you want a rag top "sports car" then go buy a MX5 and become middle aged mother trying to regain her youth.

I think that we should really concentrate our minds on a car that we can afford to buy and run with out being a pop or porn star, doesnt really mtter if its the fastest. may be we should put a budget cap on it. say £26k, $45k US, €40k.

for people who make a concious effort to save up to buy there new car.

and may be another one set at £8k, $15k, €12k for a used car.

because how many people on the list can say honestly they can afford a konisegg for example or a ferarri. More to the point who can afford to maintain an itallian stallion?

What does it matter who owns them, deciding that is merly how the company pays tax. lets look at it, take jag for example. jaguar cars ltd is wholey ownd by ford inc, ford is mainly owned by pension companies, pension companies if they are mutual are owend by u and i and we could be from azabajan to zambia. just the same if it isnt its then owend by the share holders who are from anywere. All the owenership thing is where it gets taxed. In most cases it will get taxed in the country where the profits are made, then may be less or may be more on the country of prime ownership. If your bothered who owns them then become a stockbroker. Im more bothered about what cars they make and how they perform thats why im a car enthusiast.

posted by  cinqyg

there not that unreliable actually, its more they had a run of bad parts with a run of sheer incompatance in relation to cooling system.

The reason why we have so many K series, is easy, go back to 1990 and you find me a stock 1.4 engine that gives you 110+bhp. Even look for an all alloy engine? its not going to happen the only one around is the k series. For all of you who dont understand or dont like efi then jump ship now. But if i have a little sports car like a elise for example and i want to take it to the shops ocationally i dont want peaky high revs with mid range torque loss. If im going to a track day then its another matter. So you take your laptop along to the track day and plug it in, takes 5 mins to load the new map and your sorted. when youwant to drive home same process in reverse. just like want to do a hill climb then you can chnge it again.

Cooling systems.
well lets look at what these thing mainlyover heat in, bearing in mind all engines if stood still long enough will. well we have the freelander, how oftern do you see them stuck in traffic and when was the last time you 1 off road.

then we have the mg, same old problems, mid engined cooling systems are the bane of many a engineers life.

Now the rover range, it has problem, and im not just talking about the engines in this case. how do you get the power and the cooling? well its expensive and not just that its difficult to do for typical M6 or M25 driving, stop start stationary. second gear is the holy grail. Who needs a gym when you got a Z28 with a manual box in traffic, this is the point where i wish i hadnt removed the power steering its like driving a 1950's dumper truck with a 10" steering wheel.

tale for another day.

I personally like the K series, it isnt the top of the tree now, but it served us in motorsport well for 10 years. now there are other engines around, the duratec for example looks like a intersting propsition, especially as it will mate to a MT75/ type 9 gearbox.

there is also the toyota and honda engines which are promising but rear wheel drive looks challenging to achive with out stripping one sports car to create another.

If in 1998 you can find me an engine that i can cheeply mate to a cheap RWD Gearbox, and get 100bhp/ litre with less than £1000, and offers all this at under 45kg/ 100 horses then please do. But K series anyday of the week.

Zetec i here you cry well you try geting a 1.8 or 2litre Zetec to thosepower levels and you will be in the 4-6k mark.

BTW, if you fit a race spec gasket it will be 3 times the price but last the life of the car, and when you are talking £250 labour then whats £80.

posted by  cinqyg

When did ur Mrs last check the coolant levels in her car???

posted by  cinqyg

Thanks for all of that cinqyg atleast you know what you are talking about and dont want to bitch all the time unlike other people

posted by  Car Nirvana

OK, as I am from Germany, I will try now to put a list of German Car Builders together! If I miss one please shout out loud, so that I will hear it here in Germany!

There we go:

Audi
Volkswagen
Opel
Mercedes-Benz
BMW
Porsche
Wiesmann
Karmann (remember the Karmann-Ghia)
Maybach
Isdera
Smart
AS


Truck and Bus makers:

Mercedes-Benz
MAN
Neoplan
Kaesbohrer


Then there are also a lot of famous Tuners such as:

Alpina
Irmscher
Startech
Brabus
AMG
RUF
AC Schnitzer
ABT
Mantzel
Zender
Zakspeed
Kamei
Oettinger
Steffan
Wolf
Carlssson
Lorinser
(surely there are a lot more)

The same with German firms known for making Car parts:

Bosch
Ate
INA-Kugelfischer
VDO
Blaupunkt
Bielstein
Koni
Continental
Eberspächer
Webasto
.
.
.

posted by  Diewaldo

Well i think you need to group them into company groups to make them representative.

posted by  cinqyg

Opel???? isnt that just english vauxhalls cars with badges on them? :ohcrap:

posted by  Lukaz

Oh dear please give this guy an education.

Right well since the existance of the eu then there has be moresegmentation within the manufacuting and asembly plant world.

In this case then none of the Vectras that currently are being sold new are asembled in the uk they are all made in a opel ( its all GM any way) factory in russelheim in germany (its near frankfurt) the astras for the entire of europe are assbled in Luton and so on and so forth.

The GM euro range is shared across all the countries within the eu and a few others most of the asian market and the austrailan cars are similar and depending on which country your from depends what badge they slap on them.

there are a number of non used brands which may be resirected some day just like MG has been for the rover group.

posted by  cinqyg

Cheers

im not to up on vauxhalls or opels to be honest. but i learned somthing today :thumbs: isnt that what lifes all about? :banghead:

posted by  Lukaz

Ok, so I will group them (not an easy one, but I'll try)

Daimler-Chrysler

Cars:
Mercedes-Benz (D)
Smart (D)
Chrysler (USA)
Dogde (USA)
Jeep (USA)
Maybach (D)
AMG (D)

Utility Verhicles:
Setra (D)
Mercedes-Benz (D)
Freightliner (USA)
Sterling Trucks (USA)
Western Star Trucks (USA)
FUSO (J)


Volkswagen Group

Cars:
Volkswagen (D)
Seat (Spain)
Skoda (Czech-Republic)
Bentley (GB)

Utility Vehicles:
Scania (Sweden)
Volkswagen (D)


Audi AG

Cars:
Audi (D)
Lamborghini (I)


Porsche AG


BMW AG

Cars:
BMW (D)
M GmbH (D)
Mini (GB)
Rolls-Royce (GB)

Motorcycles:
BMW (D)


Karmann AG
building mostly Convertibles for other brands, such as VW


Wiesmann
litte Company that only builts sports cars


Isdera
same as Wiesmann


AS
same as Wiesmann, they only built the Yes Roadster

posted by  Diewaldo

weve had this argument about were a nationality of a company lies, your basicaly saying becuase a compnay files for tax in german its german????

posted by  cinqyg

Because of that I wrote in such cases the origin behind the name.

posted by  Diewaldo

yeah i noticed that.

posted by  cinqyg

what is it with you??!?! why must you be an asshole to people you don't know and did NOTHING to you?


So you think your god then :screwy:


If your not interested why reply :screwy:
also Jaguar and Aston Martin maybe owned by Ford but we make, design etc them :thumbs:

posted by  Car Nirvana

Ive read in many different stats rankings that all of the most successful car companies in the world are german.

I believe the most profitable mass production car company in the world is porsche, and the second most is BMW. And in the top 5 is also the nameplate Mercecedes ( not daimler chrysler). This is profitable based on volume. Its perhaps not a strong selling point to think that the company you bought your car from made the most money off of you.... just my side comment.

Rankings change by year certainly. THis may not be updated to this year, but Im 'quoting' a recent ranking.

In terms of volume, the most successful european company is possibly volkswagen most years, but it is possibly renault which also owns nissan. Or, it is Daimlerchrysler.

posted by  stamar

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