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For full features; Go to Perhaps picking up a new used car..nobody saw this coming
Got a possible straight trade in front of me for the following..lets start
with my car
2001 honda civic lx 5-speed sedan
tan inside and out
2 sets of wheels
almost new performance suspension
new clutch and input shaft bearing
new motor mounts
new brakes all around
very good mechanically
aftermarket stereo that bumps
tint
alarm
etc.etc. other stupid shit
118k miles
for
1998 ford mustang gt 5-speed
Steeda tri-ax short shifter
new intake manifold
mach 460 stereo
power driver seat, fogs, power windows, doors, etc.
new tires
BBK cold air
BBK underdrive pulleys
Summit off-road H-pipe
91k miles
The reason I am asking is I dont know much about mustangs..I hear they are
pretty reliable and powerful but I wanted to see if any domestic experts
had anything to add here
Also, how does the 4.6 liter v8 compare to the 5.0 from the previous stangs
newyorker
what happened to "i don't like domestic cars"?
windsonian
newyorker's mood changes depending on the time of the month.
Mathew
Wow guys you totally answered my questions :thumbs:
newyorker
What also happened to that new engine that you already paid the deposit for
and is being shipped from Japan?
Nissan_Altima
Wow a great answer from a USP student...you all are a bright bunch arent
you. The engine order was cancelled and the deposit returned, why; thats
noone's business but mine. Now stop wasting my time since you dont know
shit, thank you so much!
newyorker
We're wasting YOUR time???
How can we take you seriously on posts like the one above if you COMPLETELY
contradict it, and then don't even try to explain it to us?
We'll just assume everything you say means nothing.... like the post
above... so it would be OUR time being wasted if we bothered imparting any
knowledge or opinions on you.
btw, for people interested, that quote was from this thread
(http://www.car-forums.com/talk/showthread.php?p=248930).
windsonian
Huh? I don't go to USP...
Everything you say is SUCH bullshit. How can any one take your pathetic
attempts at posts seriously?
Nissan_Altima
Wow you guys are retarded..great job! Im surprised you all passed reading
comprehension.
newyorker
Sorry you go to UPENN..students from both schools are usually so stuck up
that I cant tell them apart.
newyorker
I'm pretty sure everyone understands your question. We just can't
comprehend whether you're telling the truth this time or not...
That being said, I can't help you with your claimed problem.
chris_knows
Forget it guys, the car is sold.
newyorker
How many students from Penn do you know? How about from USP? I hate to
break it to you, but the two schools are COMPLETELY different with
COMPLETELY different students.
That's actually not important though. I remember when you were arguing with
a member (the name and thread escapes me, sorry) and he said that when you
are wrong, you do one of two things: you either change the subject or just
ignore the question. You just did the former of the two.
Response fixed.
Nissan_Altima
We did... we can comprehend that you said you have no intention of buying a
domestic, then expect us to completely disregard that and just answer your
questions about buying one without even querying your apparent about face.
I guess either you realised your own naive attitude, or something changed
your mind. Either way, is it so unfair for us to know which, before we
spend time trying to help you on your latest fad.
My guess is that, with your being impressionable, someone at your new car
yard job told you that domestics are good, and you dropped your old
opinions and took on his/hers wholus bolus. But hey, I might be way off.
windsonian
Guys, guys, relax...it's a regular ricer transition. Eventually they see
that their cars suck and think they have to go to big American muscle to
make up for their wrongs.
I think he's being serial.
jedimario
Nope...you guys really cant comprehend a question im surprised some of you
figured out how to register for this forum
newyorker
Seriosly that car will SUCK.
The NA mod motors BLOW. Then your buying a 2 valve, which are even more
pitiful. I dont even think the 98s are the PI heads, which are insanely
scktacular.
Dont buy the car, it will be EXTREMELY slow til you get pretty far into
mods.
I watched a car JUST like this get walked by and intake and exhaust
automatic scion tC, call BS all you want but it happened twice in a row,
once from a roll once from a dig.
And why trade your car when you have a K series on order, which will be
delivered in justa few months?
Enthusiast
Oh and youll love working on the mod motors in those cars. IT SUCKS. I can
do timing belts on most hondas in under an hour.
I wont even attempt to install LT headers on a SN95 or new platform. Screw
it. Those motors suck to work on and the power you get from mods make it
even less worth it.
Enthusiast
That order got cancelled and I got my deposit money back...had a change of
heart and dedcided that school payments were more important than an engine,
and would save me from loans in the future.
newyorker
The only question you actually asked was:
You never actually asked anything about the trade, despite saying "the
reason i ask".
How's that for comprehension?
windsonian
No, I asked if anyone has any knowledge about that mustang...funny how
everything has to be specifically pointed out to you, and that you cant
understand an implied question in something
newyorker
so, what you're saying is that your idea of "reading comprehension" is me
being able to understand what you're saying, even when you don't say it.
Don't bitch about people not answering a question never asked. Sure, maybe
there was a question implied there, but what about my question? Okay, I'll
word it a bit more nicely.
What has happened to change your mind regarding domestic cars?
windsonian
I did say it.
Nothing really changed my mind, I still think they are rattly, and not very
well made aside from the engine and drivetrain, and are not engineered up
to par with their Japanese and European competitors, but they are things I
can live with given the performance that a GT offers..unforunately like
Enthusiast said, that 4.6 isnt the best to mod, plus the car is already
gone nor is it an all season driver because the back end is light as all
shit. Working at a dealership now, I can get a lot of experienced feedback
on my choices as far as quality and such go since my boss has been doin his
job for quite some time, but its up to me to reach out and get more info
cause hes in his 50s and doesnt know shit about modding, he just has his
911 turbo and hes OK lol
newyorker
so the domestic's superior performance changed your mind?
windsonian
Its not their superior performance, they certainly dont all outperform
other cars, but with cars like the new Saturn Aura, and the F150 being a
very solid truck, I duno I just kinda opened my eyes and realized that not
all of them are piles of shit
newyorker
Your retarded.
The mustang is a fine all season driver, if you dont act stupid. All these
people bitch about RWD in the rain and snow, and FWD is better. FWD is only
a crutch so people can act stupid in bad weather and stay out of
trouble.
My car has always had UHPS tires or better on it and I drive it no matter
what. Even in light snow it is no problem.
If your worried about driving it in the winter, stay with FWD. Youll hurt
yourself with a real car.
Enthusiast
Plain and simple domestic performance cars can go faster for the same
invested in an import.
Enthusiast
No im sure an NSX with the money invested to match the price of a corvette
will demolish it
newyorker
I talked to a guy who is on his 6th mustang already (and this is the second
cobra) and he said that even the v6 ones are not drivable in the snow, he
tried every year and they didnt move. You live in texas where it snows
every time president bush makes a smart statement, I live in PA where it
snows every winter, and sometimes hard too
newyorker
Yeah, but for the price of a 2005 NSX, I could buy 2 2005 Corvettes lol.
chris_knows
Fixed.
jedimario
Says the one with the slow Si
newyorker
Yes but when you get an NSX you get an NSX, youre not just another yuppy
with a mohawk and 8 cylinders, not that the vette is a bad car, but its
just a fact..NSX is more exclusive, looks better IMO, and just overall
tickles me more..and everyone I know..besides I dont think a non Z06 or ZR1
(coming soon I hope) vette is a waste of money
newyorker
Uh C5s are not expensive at all.
And it takers ALOT of money to mod an NSX. And you dont get much from
them.
Their is a saying among NSX owners. How do you accumulate a small fortune
while building a boosted NSX...Start with a large fortune.
Enthusiast
Maybe he should learn to drive.
And Ive been all over the country, and driven in all kinds of bad
conditions. Im stickin with RWD.
Shit Ive been in a snow storm in Wyoming visiting my brother while driving
a 05 Dodge Ram with 20 and a 275mm foot print (the wider the worse they
perform in snow and rain), a LSD, and an unloaded bed. I had no
problems.
Ive driven the maro in snow. All you have to do is not act like a retard. I
dont even leave the traction control on. Also leaving a stop in 2 or 3rd
helps to.
Enthusiast
Hey whats up i know this isnt the right Thread to ask this question but
maybe you can help me out
My car Is a 1998 Honda Accord 4cyl VTEC I want to put in a New Header for
it but it says.........Non-VTEC 2.0L Inline 4-Cylinder N/A Engine..... on
the part description does that mean i cant put it in my car here is the
link if you want to know what i am talking about
bigman101
More ignorant Ricer bullshit.
Its funny since imports get dominated in a straight line, yall have to
default to 2 things.
-Imports always Perform better in Twisties
-"Anyone can go fast in a straight line"
WRONG.
Yah Drag Racing is easy when youve only got 150hp. Try it in a decent car,
thats got some power.
You dont think people with F-bodies and mustangs set their cars up for
autoX and road course racing.
I can think of a certain F-body that has less in his car (including car and
suspension setup) probably than your Si. And trust me he will DESTROY you
around ANY track. Its easy when you've got a good suspension setup, and
over 12" of slick at each corner.
Grow up.
Enthusiast
Yah if you spend all the money to get an NSX. You get an expensive ass car,
that their is next to no aftermarket for, comapered to the likes of the
vette and viper, is slow as balls, has a measly 260 hp (AHAHHAHAHA), and
you really cant do much to them N/A, so your stuck with a HUGE bill for
forced induction or your stuck with 260hp.
NSXs are decent cars if left bone stock, and would probably be fun to drive
everyday, and I do think the the early NA-1s (with the pop up headlights)
are nice looking, but Id take a vette over them just cause of the HUGE
aftermarket support, and the ease and cost of maintenance.
Enthusiast
Wasn't the NSX cut from production because it was not selling very well?
This might sound ignorant, and right me if I'm wrong, but isn't that what
made it so exclusive?
chris_knows
It wasnt selling well because not a whole lot of people were willing to
shell out 70+k for a Honda, no matter who helped design it. Enthusiast I
get where you are coming from, but its just a matter of preference, thats
why there are so many different cars out there on the roads, because not
everyone has the same opinion. You are right about the NSX being expensive
to mod, and the vette being more powerful, but no matter the facts, I can
still disagree with you all day because I would take an NSX over a c5 any
day (unless its a Z06 then I would have to think). Yea I was wrong about
domestics on some accounts, I will admit that, and god only knows how much
fun I had driving our 6-speed jeep liberty around for work, much more than
my civic even though it feels like its driving on stilts compared to my
car, but some things I still stick to. For the most part I think domestics
dont have the style and sophistication of imports, but then again with the
new Saturn Aura being simply gorgeous, as well as the new Astra, and
Chevy's flex-fuel technology, I could be very wrong very soon..
newyorker
but you admit that the Mustang's superior performance changed your mind
anout not buying and import?
windsonian
It's funny how you domestic supremacists always default to 2 things.
-domestics always perform better in a straight line, therefore they're
better cars
-anyone who thinks otherwise is a ricer and should be burned at the
stake
He also has a pos F-body.
And why on earth are you calling me a ricer? When have I ever done or said
anything that even remotely resembles the ricer attitude? Show me, I
challenge you. My fixed comment was more of a joke than anything, a little
extreme to balance out your extreme comment. By the way, I never even came
close to implying that going in a straight line is easy and corners are
hard...so you're essentially arguing with nobody. Just so you know :wink2:
Anyway, let's talk about the whole ignorant ricer thing. Here comes my
ignorance spewing from the innermost parts of my tiny ricer brain...
Generally, performance cars made by American companies will go faster in a
straight line than car made by companies from other countries, while cars
made by companies from other countries will go faster than cars made by
American companies "in the twisties". There are plenty of exceptions of
course, but many, if not most, cars will follow that rule whether they've
been modified or not.
Ok, now let's talk about this Civic vs. F-body thing, and see which car
would be the best choice for me.
I am an 18 year old college student with fairly little knowledge in the way
of auto mechanics who needs a car that won't break down and wants a car
that would be fun to drive around on a daily basis. Modding is out of the
question, since my parents own the car and won't allow it. I will also
have to pay for part of the insurance. Also, mom says it must be safe.
Ok, now that we know a little bit about me, let's do a little breakdown of
each car's pros and cons.
Reliability-the car just has to be. If it breaks down, I'm just out of
luck until it gets fixed, cause I probably can't do it myself.
2005 Civic Si > F-body, no question there, no need to explain.
Fun/performance-not a requirement, but would be nice to have.
2005 Civic Si > F-body, and I will explain this one.
The Civic is a 2800lb, FWD hatchback. The F-body is a ~3100lb or more RWD
coupe. Well, the F-body certainly has more power...but honestly going in a
straight line is a bit of a bore, especially on the street. Since I will
not excessively speed for risk of getting a ticket, I would run out of fun
very fast just going in a straight line. Now is there really any question
about which one of these is more fun going around a turn? I assume they
both have relatively high front weight ratios, but I can't find any exact
figures. But the Civic is at least 300-400lbs lighter. I'm told that
Mustangs and Camaros and the like are total pigs in the turns, and I at
least know that my Civic is better than that.
Also, just one sit in a late nineties Firebird, and I hated the thing. I
felt like I was lying down, and the shifter was way stiffer than any ever
should be. Speaking of shifters, the EP3 has it in an unusual, but perfect
location, thus helping the fun factor quite a bit.
In short, I think my Civic is a blast, and I seriously doubt that ANY stock
Mustang, Camaro, Firebird, or other muscle car would be more fun for me.
Then there's safety.
2005 Civic Si > F-body
Well, probably anyway. I'm not looking up ratings for every F-body, but
the random ones I did look up were all worse than the Civic.
Insurance
2005 Civic Si < F-body
Not much there, insurance on the Civic is about 3 times more
And a couple of other things...
gas mileage
2005 Civic Si > F-body
practicality
2005 Civic Si > F-body
Anything important I'm missing?
So, you tell me, in my case, how on earth is an F-body better than a Civic
Si? It's not.
Lastly, my parents bought the car so it was more up to them than me anyway.
I have to take what I can get, and they were going to get something
nice...nicer than most any f-body.
In summary:
I'm not a ricer, and there's no way you can legitimately say that I am.
Imports typically are faster than domestics in the twisties.
Domestics are typically faster than imports in a straight line.
A Civic Si is much better choice of car for me than an F-body, and I'm
quite happy with it.
jedimario
Well noone said that it changed my mind, it was simply an very generous
option that was in front of me at the time, so of course I gave it some
though, and by the time that I made my decision (not to do the trade for
practicality, insurance, gas, etc.) the car was already gone to another
buyer.
Yes the mustang v8 has superior performance, but no I dont think its as
refined as even my civic..the interior looks like crap to be honest, but
those are things that I could live with given it's performance.
I still have lots of time to decide on my next car (and I have more options
than before because with my new job I can get my car at wholesale price,
which is considerably more friendly on the wallet), and I work with people
who have been buying and selling and owning cars for longer than I have
been around, so if all else fails, I'm sure I can get some feedback from
them, suggestions as well, on what to get, and of course the "dealer
advantage" when it comes to paying for it.
At the moment, I dont have any specific car that my mind is set on, but I
want it to be better than what I have now of course. Something more
powerful, more fun, etc. but I dont want it to be a hassle owning it. Ive
got some time to work and make some money, I'm not in a big rush to get a
different car anytime soon, because its more of a want than a need, so I am
open to realistic suggestions as well, although they wont be acted on for
quite some time.
I fell in love with the Mini Cooper S after driving 2 of them (05
supercharged 6MT, 07 Turbocharged 6AT), its just a hoot to drive, yet it
still gets great MPG, looks great, and is very roomy inside, but small
outside (great for parking and such), the only thing turning me off about
it is that being made by BMW (one of the more reliable euro car brands, not
that its saying much), I dont know how prone it is to taking shits when it
comes to reliability.
Ive got lots of time to make money, make a decision, and along the way I am
sure I will get to drive lots of cool shit that will be considerable for my
next purchase, along with some cars that I love that I'm sure wont be what
I expect them to be.
Time will tell.
newyorker
I did.
You went from saying you had NO plans to buy a domestic, to considering
trading your car for one.... you changed your mind.
windsonian
Yes but I didnt say that I changed my mind about not buying an import..I
still would buy an import
newyorker
huh? but you wouldn't not buy a domestic.
windsonian
I would, but I would be a bit more picky about it than an import. I would
check the engine 5 times over and then have a mechanic look it over, I
would spend about 2 weeks, reading reviews and doing research, etc. When I
got my civic I just found it and bought it, and it has served me well, with
only wear and tear (except for input shaft bearing..stupid 1st gear
downshifts).
I gota say I really liked that 6-speed liberty we had though it was a
blast..shifter is hard as hell to work with cause its not very precise or
smooth but still a great time. I got pix of it I will upload as soon as my
camera gets fixed..my boss decided to unplug it and the card is corrupted
but the pix are OK I gota extract them
With my mindset about domestics now, something really nice would have to
slap me in the face really hard to get my attention, that or a really
really really good deal that if I'm not happy with I can make money on a
few months down the road.
newyorker
I called you a ricer, cause you defaulted to the american cars dont handle
well. What basis does this statement have?
Your friends told you f-bpdys are pigs in the corner!
There are plenty of capable handling domestics and their are plenty of pigs
made in japan.
Here are some stats on the F-bodys.
The 02 WS6 (according to MT)
.84 Gs
64.6 mph slalom
I really dont think thats bad at all considering the e36 did it in 63.6 mph
according to MT
the 99 Firehawk (also according to MT)
.89Gs
66mph slalom
even better.
All the F-bodys that me and my firends have, have been more than
reliable.
Mine at 107K miles.
Has been EXTREMELY RELIABLE
Only broken tranny caused by me
and A tore up motor due to a faulty cam dowel pin (not a GM an aftertmarket
thing)
If I didnt mod it It wouldnt have broken
Buddies TA at 164K miles.
Still hold great oil pressure and the only thing hes had to fix in the last
~50K miles was 2 02 sensors.
Another Friends 02 Z28
Has had to do NOTHING to it outside of a clutch at 121K miles (the original
lasted that long).
Ill give you the safety thing as Im to lazy to look them up, and I could
care less about practicality in a discusion about perfromance cars but gas
mileage in an F-body isnt bad at all.
I get 28mpg from a 3.73 geared (stock are 3:42) LT1 M6 Z28.
LS1s get better mileage and a stock geared car will help to.
Ive seen over 30mpg from a few f-bodys, but my best is 28.
Which isnt bad at all as far as im concerned when I have a 5.7L V8.
Enthusiast
Sure its the better choice for you, but if I had 9 kids a minivan would be
the bets decision for me. That doesnt hold any merit in a perfromance
discussion or a perfromance per dollar discusion though.
Your import, domestic generalizations have no backing. Thats why I call you
a ricer. You cannot judge a complete set of cars on just the places they
wer built. You have to judge and compare them on a smaller level.
To make generalizations like that is just retarded.
Thatd be like me saying imports do X bad. I cant cause there are always
exceptions. And dont get me wrong, I like all cars for certain things
(including imports).
Enthusiast
I really just want to say neither do yours, but I'll hold back...
Because they do have backing.
Look, this wasn't supposed to be an argument about performance cars. You
made a bs statement, I called you on it. Ever heard the saying "actors use
lies to tell the truth"? Same concept. Next time, realize that instead of
shooting off and making bogus accusations about someone you don't even
know.
jedimario
If It was a BS statement then disprove it.
First off domestic performance cars usually come with big simple motors
which are usually easy to make power with. Seriously right now the SBC (Gen
I-IV) is hard to beat in a perfromance per dollar comaprison.
Second we have the home field advantage. Im sure its cheaper to make a
japanese car faster in japan.
Enthusiast
An Enzo Ferrari will go faster in a straight line than your Camaro.
jedimario
whatever.... you've still changed your mind then.
windsonian
Yes but I could go faster than an enzo for the price of one.
Enthusiast
No...I would still rather have an Import, but there are certain vehicles
that I think the Colonies make better trucks and SUVs, but for a car, I
would rather stick to the japanese. Euro...eh..il get one if it is new or
still under warranty
newyorker
But an Enzo is a Ferrari..an F-body isnt, and your F-body would never
handle like an Enzo, nor would it have the same value..
newyorker
"Rather have one" and "will not buy one" are 2 very different things. Just
admit you changed your mind, even if you won't say what changed it.
windsonian
So could I...stay on topic or shut up.
jedimario
Correction.
Your retarded. Ive seen skidpad numbers from modified F-bodys over 1Gs.
And I have also seen better slalom numbers than your almighty enzo.
Quit being a nut swinger and look shit up.
Im dont have the money to buy an enzo so its kinda a plus that an f-body
wouldnt have the same value as an enzo.
Yah I no its a Ferrari. Id take the Chevy, cause I break parts and I enjoy
being able to pay to have the car fixed, and not feel bad when I abuse the
hell out of the car.
Enthusiast
Shit even a boxster BONE STOCK can go through the slalom faster than the
enzo.
Enthusiast
Screw the Enzo, I'd rather have a Civic.
fudge
Screw the Enzo.....I'd rather have the money. Invest it properly and you
could have lots of high-end vehicles. :smoke:
Speaking of which, anyone got a few million dollars they want to
permanently loan me? hehehe
dodgerforlife
Hey now!
Some of us live on mountains in New England. If I drove my Camaro in the
winter I'd have to buy 4 wheels and new tires (I dunno the width of my
tires, but as you said, fat is bad). Then I'd have to pay more insurance
(compared to my Oldsmobile), and more for gas. And what for? So I could
rack up miles on my nice car when I can't REALLY drive it most of the time?
Then you add in the rust factor.
So let's recap:
The Olds is easier to drive in the winter
Over the years I'll at least break even financially
The Camaro will last twice as long and look better doing it
Every spring it's like I bought a brand new car (exciting)
giant016
The 3 bolded I couldnt agree more. Thats the reason Im picking up a DD, and
so I can finally have time to have the maro down and redo it.
The other one is also true, its EASIER to drive in winter. BUT I was simply
trying to say that RWD is fine to drive in bad weather if you dont act
retarded, although maybe in a harsh way, haha.
Enthusiast
For most people, yes I'll agree that RWD is doable. However, even if I
wanted to I couldn't drive the Camaro in the winter unless I wnated to park
it at the bottom of the Mt. and walk up whenever there is a storm. Not
going to happen.
giant016
