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Old 01-25-2011, 01:27 AM   #1
99integra
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God bless the fallen

http://www.baynews9.com/video?clip=h...nshots_124.f4v

This just happened a half a mile from my house and all you could hear was gun shots. 2011 has been a bad year so far for my family because we also lost Deputy Suzanne Hopper who worked with my uncle in the same precinct. They were a legit couple but broke up a couple years ago. She gave him custody of now my cousin Charley when they broke up. She was still part of the family and she is very greatly missed, this happened January 1st.

http://www.odmp.org/officer/20636-de...suzanne-hopper
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Old 02-04-2011, 02:53 AM   #2
Wally
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My sympathy to your family.

I'd like to dare a question if I may. It seems to me American individuals are by and large armed to the teeth in preparedness for imminent attack from some evil doer. Does knowing the person you are having a conversation with, may be armed, prevent you from having a frank, open and heated argument?

I suspect I'm not alone with many people around the world when we see clips of tragic shootings in the USA and think there is something very wrong with a cultural mindset that seems to worship the gun. I still can't get used to seeing our coppers carrying guns, something I never saw as a boy.
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Old 02-06-2011, 05:16 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wally
I'd like to dare a question if I may. It seems to me American individuals are by and large armed to the teeth in preparedness for imminent attack from some evil doer. Does knowing the person you are having a conversation with, may be armed, prevent you from having a frank, open and heated argument?

I suspect I'm not alone with many people around the world when we see clips of tragic shootings in the USA and think there is something very wrong with a cultural mindset that seems to worship the gun. I still can't get used to seeing our coppers carrying guns, something I never saw as a boy.
Since this forum no longer seems to be centered around cars (or anything for that matter), we may as well make it about guns. If you'd like to have an open and honest discussion about guns and gun ownership in the US I'll be happy to oblige. If not, thisíll be my only post.

To answer your question directly, no. Guns in the hands of law abiding citizens are not a problem, and they really never have been. I carry a gun essentially everywhere, essentially all the time. So does my wife. The only places we don't carry are because they're restricted by unconstitutional laws, but we still try to respect the law. Many of my friends and acquaintances do the same.

We (gun owners/carriers) most certainly have discussions, disagreements and even heated arguments. Having guns present are never a reason not to speak our minds and are never used as a form of intimidation. They are just tools that we have in our possession.

We carry guns not because we have an unreasonable fear of others, but because we know that evil does exist. We don't carry because we want to scare, intimidate, injure or kill another human being, but because we want to be able to go home and sleep in our own bed at night. Keep in mind that just because you see the headlines about some unfortunate circumstance where people have been killed by gunfire, that is the exception rather than the rule. More people are killed every year in the US in car wrecks than by guns. And guns are used from 1.5 to 2.5 million (with an ďmĒ) every year, depending on whose numbers you believe, to stop a crime. Most of the time, shots are never fired.

I'll bet you have smoke detectors and fire extinguishers in your home not because you expect it to catch on fire, but just in case it does. I know you wear your seat belt not because you intend to have a wreck, but want to be prepared if you do. We maintain guns for self defense for exactly the same reason.

Keep in mind that self defense is not the only reason to own a firearm. We enjoy collecting (accumulating) guns because of their history, their design, for sport and because sometimes we just like to hear them go bang.

Thereís a lot more to say, but Iíll hold off for now. If you have any specific questions to ask, please do. I think we can make this a great learning opportunity.

In closing, here is a picture of the gun I have on my hip right now. It's an FN Herstal FNP9-M. Itís been around for a while and hasnít shot anyone yet. My hope is to keep it that way.



http://www.fnherstal.com/index.php?i...t=1&no_cache=1

.
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Old 02-06-2011, 10:24 AM   #4
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I would like to understand it a bit better without getting into statistics and hyberbole.

They tightened up here after the Port Arthur massacre, with owners needing to keep ammunition in a safe, seperate from the gun. There has to be a good reason to gain a licence, I don't think personal protection is one of them. Even before that event guns licences were hard to get.

I myself spent many a night, as a youth, spot shooting. From the very beginning the rules were drummed into me to prevent an accident. This, of course was rifle use, something that isn't generally close at hand and even then I would not have pondered using it to repel aggressors. I'm fairly sure the laws here are reasonable force and gun play is seen as fairly extreme.

In our culture gun ownership tends to be something that isn't thought about much, if at all. A cocky might have one to shoot a few vermin in the paddocks or put down the odd sick sheep, there's the usual target shooting clubs, professional pig, horse, buffalo and roo shooters, but personally I'm not aware of anyone who carries a side arm (except coppers).
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Old 02-06-2011, 02:20 PM   #5
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Okay. So fire away (pun may be intended) with any questions you have. I'll do my best to explain and help you understand why about 1/3 of the US population owns at least one firearm.
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Old 02-07-2011, 12:54 AM   #6
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Alrighty

First question: a) What is primary perceived threat that can be mitigated by owning a handgun. b) Is it deterent value or intent to use?

Second question: Is there an expectation that guns will decrease the severity of violent attack or an acknowledgement that criminals will use excessive force in an attempt to exceed the risk?

Third question: Is there a degree of pride and prejudice in toting a gun? I ask this because it seems to me a lot of stock is put in "patriot" history, especially the colonial civil war with England, the Indian wars and your Civil war. Ever vigilante as it were.

Fourth question: Do people require proof of training in the use of firearms?

Fifth question: Can citizens, by and large, carry a concealed gun? Do sidearms need to be carried in latchable holsters?

Sixth question: Practically speaking, what calibre of people are prevented from purchasing firearms.

Seventh question: Is there a frequent review of licence holders and traceabiility/whereabouts of their firearms?

Eighth question: Cars have registration/ID plates visible for all to see. Is gun ownership similarly transparent or is covert ownership part of any deterent? Do the local police hold a register of licenced guns within their district? Are owners compelled to register with the local police or face prosecution?
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Old 02-13-2011, 01:59 AM   #7
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* 8a. Once again this depends on the state, and/or locality. Some people believe advertising their ownership is a deterent. Some people prefer stealth. I personally don't care either way as long as the wrong people don't know. My main concern is theft while I'm away.

* 8b. I think this was covered in 6 or 7. Some places yes, some places no. Not where I live.

* 8c. See 8b.

One thing I wanted to add concerning open public records of gun registration, gun owner registration (see Illinois) and Concealed Weapons Permits. In just about every place in the US this has been done, there has been problems. Anti-gun, anti-rights nut jobs have culled the names and addresses of gun owners and harrassed law abiding citizens simply because they own guns. The anti-gun, anti-rights loonies know no boundries when it comes to making themselves heard.


"Among the many misdeeds of the British rule in India, history will look upon the act of depriving a whole nation of arms, as the blackest." - Mahatma Ghandi
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Old 02-14-2011, 09:30 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris_knows
For clarification, by "assault rifle" I meant a rifle with selective fire. From what I've read, they are extremely popular with gangs that smuggle drugs from Mexico, and a majority of the guns were bought in the U.S.



http://www.nssfblog.com/report-shatt...os-gun-supply/
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Old 02-22-2011, 01:39 PM   #9
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I'm sorry. I thought we were going to have a discussion.

Nevermind.
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Old 02-24-2011, 10:09 AM   #10
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Well we can discuss it if you like. But bear in mind this is one of those cultural divide subjects: I reside in a place where guns aren't proflic (supposedly).

No one could deny the economic and political success of the USA over the last century and I have a feeling that gun ownership is an ingredient in that recipe. Whether that translates into desirable lifestyle is something that is a qualitative decision; we see peoples around the world who live in abject poverty and deprivation, but many still champion their nationality and faiths, a few manage to escape into first world countries..
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