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Old 06-19-2004, 04:54 PM   #1
JaneiR36
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A/c Inop

While I'm waiting for responses on my light bulb problems, I may as well post about my A/C. It doesn't blow cold air. I've tried topping off the freon, but it doesn't seem to be sucking anything from the can even with the vehicle on and the A/C on full blast. My sister once had it checked out, and they said it would cost about $300 to fix (I have no details on what's wrong, sorry). I'd like to confirm this for myself without getting it professionally tested again. If you have any ideas for dianosing the problems, please let me know. I will need very simplified instructions because I'm a total beginner in this.

Car: Toyota Camry '96 LE, Automatic shift, 4 cylinders.

PS: I'm having difficulty searching for past A/C topics, because it says "A/C" is too short to be included in a search, and of course people tend not to write out "air conditioner" in their posts (only found four topics with that).

Oh, I've checked the two A/C fuses located at the passenger side kick panel. They are intact.

Last edited by JaneiR36 : 06-19-2004 at 10:50 PM.
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Old 06-19-2004, 11:22 PM   #2
DodgeRida67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JaneiR36
While I'm waiting for responses on my light bulb problems, I may as well post about my A/C. It doesn't blow cold air. I've tried topping off the freon, but it doesn't seem to be sucking anything from the can even with the vehicle on and the A/C on full blast. My sister once had it checked out, and they said it would cost about $300 to fix (I have no details on what's wrong, sorry). I'd like to confirm this for myself without getting it professionally tested again. If you have any ideas for dianosing the problems, please let me know. I will need very simplified instructions because I'm a total beginner in this.

Car: Toyota Camry '96 LE, Automatic shift, 4 cylinders.

PS: I'm having difficulty searching for past A/C topics, because it says "A/C" is too short to be included in a search, and of course people tend not to write out "air conditioner" in their posts (only found four topics with that).

Oh, I've checked the two A/C fuses located at the passenger side kick panel. They are intact.


Check if your compressor clutch is engauging and if not, check if it's getting power to the clutch. If it's not getting power from there, go to the a/c relay and check if that is getting power on the coil side as well as the contact side.

Report back


HTH
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Old 06-20-2004, 04:10 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DodgeRida67
Check if your compressor clutch is engauging and if not, check if it's getting power to the clutch. If it's not getting power from there, go to the a/c relay and check if that is getting power on the coil side as well as the contact side.

Report back


HTH

Thanks for replying! But um... could you please idiot-proof your instructions for me? What instruments to use, how-to's, what the compressor clutch, a/c relay, coil side, and contact side are? (hopefully, there really are no minimum requirements for joining this site ). I'll be doing some research in my Hayne's manual, but the truth is I've always had difficulty understanding it because there seems to be an underlying assumption that anyone reading it has an intermediate to advanced knowledge of cars.

I'm pretty sure anyone can help me from here on out, just in identifying the parts and such, and what to do with them. I really can't imagine anyone having less knowledge about cars than I do right now...
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Old 06-20-2004, 02:36 PM   #4
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I recall now that the extent of the Hayne's manual information on A/C is something about R-12 / R-134 conversion, and other than that they say it's outside the scope of their manual. I'm really going to need some help on this!
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Old 06-20-2004, 07:16 PM   #5
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Something has me worried. Before we get started answer something for me. You said you topped off your freon. What type does your car use?
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Old 06-20-2004, 07:39 PM   #6
JaneiR36
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well, I'll be. I'm just realizing that I've been assuming it was the 'environmentally friendly' R-134a, because the vehicle was manufactured after 1993. Are there any exceptions to this, and if so, how can I find out for sure? Yes I did try to top off the freon with a kit we bought from the auto store. We've used it on my Mom's '96 Accord and it worked just fine. I did have to use some kind of adapter provided in the kit for the Camry, so I'm now wondering if the fittings were not tight enough or didn't push the valve in properly to enable intake of the fluid. ARGH!!! I'm totally confusing myself!!

Okay, I also realize I did not mention an actual symptom. When you push the A/C button with the fan blower on, the little A/C light stays lit for about ten or so seconds before it starts flashing. Either way, no cool air comes out ever.
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Old 06-23-2004, 01:54 PM   #7
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Bad news - no luck with the Hayne's manual. (although I did find one I needed )


I say you should call some garages and ask them which wires to use to test the OHMs in the clutch coil. It's either that, internet searching, or buy the shop manual.
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Old 06-23-2004, 08:45 PM   #8
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before you spend your money...

go to advanded auto parts or autozoo(autozone)
and see if you can buy just the a/c clutch or if you have to buy the whole compressor if you can buy the clutch keep going but if not pay the 300 and get the pro to do it compressor's really are tough and your going to have to pay to have your system evacuated by a pro anyways...

note to cm: I'm a mechanic student right now and I honestly believe when I get out in the industry that i will earn every penny I make
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Old 06-23-2004, 09:37 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pieface
before you spend your money...

go to advanded auto parts or autozoo(autozone)
and see if you can buy just the a/c clutch or if you have to buy the whole compressor if you can buy the clutch keep going but if not pay the 300 and get the pro to do it compressor's really are tough and your going to have to pay to have your system evacuated by a pro anyways...

note to cm: I'm a mechanic student right now and I honestly believe when I get out in the industry that i will earn every penny I make

Well Pieface, you go big guy...just a few words of advice first. Before you "get out in the industry," make sure you learn way more than you seem to know on this forum. Go back and read some of your postings (particularly with a/c) and I can tell you that you have typed information that is totally incorrect or made assumptions that are not necessarily true. You cannot take a problem, particularly online and with NO other information to go on, and roll it into a bunch of assumptions and then type an "if this then this" statement and expect people to buy it. It won't work and I can't stand it when people do that on here. You are supposed to take what the person types and ask probing questions so that you can help them narrow down where the problem might be....AND ALWAYS remember if the car ain't in front of you, you can't promise anything to anyone.

Because you've demonstrated that you are not a deep thinker and you are giving very shallow advice which may or may not help someone , you'd not touch a car of mine with a ten foot pole. Good luck, you've got a lot more learning to do before I'd consider you a mechanic. You're like the ones I cringe at the thought of making statement like: "Well, if the compressor doesn't come on when you press the button and you don't hear the engine rev slightly to compensate for the HP draw, then you might as well pay a professional to replace the compressor." Sound familiar? What kind of advice is this? Surely they teach you in automotive school that there are MANY things that could cause a compressor to not engage short of the compressor being bad? Use your head and THINK a little more than that.
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Old 06-30-2004, 10:56 PM   #10
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DodgeRida67 maybe you can help me?

Hope you all don't mind me jumping in on this thread.
I'm having A/c trouble on a 97 Mustang. I'm looking at it for a friend. She was told by a Ford dealer it would cost $1500 just in parts. They said it needs a new compressor, accumulator and lines. I found the parts online for under $500. So i don't trust them. Anyway, friend says A/C worked great, car sat undriven for 3 days then started blowing hot air.

Used voltage meter like you posted.
Disconnect harness at compressor and messured only 0.02v
Hot harness to ground was .08
Neg. harness to pos. battery is 13.89v
Ohms at compressor was 3.8 ohms

All these were the same with the A/c on reg. or Max. and in the off postition.
Fan blows a lot harder when I put it on Max A/C (seems like the switch is working) but all votage readings stays the same at compressor harness.
any info would be great?
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Old 06-30-2004, 11:10 PM   #11
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Old 08-13-2004, 04:27 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JaneiR36
While I'm waiting for responses on my light bulb problems, I may as well post about my A/C. It doesn't blow cold air. I've tried topping off the freon, but it doesn't seem to be sucking anything from the can even with the vehicle on and the A/C on full blast. My sister once had it checked out, and they said it would cost about $300 to fix (I have no details on what's wrong, sorry). I'd like to confirm this for myself without getting it professionally tested again. If you have any ideas for dianosing the problems, please let me know. I will need very simplified instructions because I'm a total beginner in this.

Car: Toyota Camry '96 LE, Automatic shift, 4 cylinders.

PS: I'm having difficulty searching for past A/C topics, because it says "A/C" is too short to be included in a search, and of course people tend not to write out "air conditioner" in their posts (only found four topics with that).

Oh, I've checked the two A/C fuses located at the passenger side kick panel. They are intact.
petethegreek---First of all , without a set of guages there is no way of knowing what high and low side pressure is. If you know what the pressure readings are then you generally know what direction to go in. Sight unseen , it is almost impossible to diagnose a symptom without any info . All these suggestions that you have recieved are just educated guesses.You cant even begin to imagine how many diff. problems can cause your symptoms. Even though you don't want to spend the $ to have it diagnosed , that is the best way. And by the way , you must be certified to handle refrigerant. Oh, and one more thing, you mentioned earlier that you " topped off the freon" . How do you know how low it was and how much you added? The only way of knowing this is with a scale under your refrigerant tank, or with a premeasured amount, or by monitoring pressures as you fill, and if you had to add that means that there is a leak, if there is a leak that means there is air and contaminants in the system. As you can see there is alot to an a/c system , and thats just the tip of the ice-berg. Bottom line, TAKE IT TO A CERTIFIED REPAIR FACILITY AND HAVE IT DONE RIGHT , " ONCE "
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Old 08-13-2004, 04:51 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by petethegreek
petethegreek---First of all , without a set of guages there is no way of knowing what high and low side pressure is. If you know what the pressure readings are then you generally know what direction to go in. Sight unseen , it is almost impossible to diagnose a symptom without any info . All these suggestions that you have recieved are just educated guesses.You cant even begin to imagine how many diff. problems can cause your symptoms. Even though you don't want to spend the $ to have it diagnosed , that is the best way. And by the way , you must be certified to handle refrigerant. Oh, and one more thing, you mentioned earlier that you " topped off the freon" . How do you know how low it was and how much you added? The only way of knowing this is with a scale under your refrigerant tank, or with a premeasured amount, or by monitoring pressures as you fill, and if you had to add that means that there is a leak, if there is a leak that means there is air and contaminants in the system. As you can see there is alot to an a/c system , and thats just the tip of the ice-berg. Bottom line, TAKE IT TO A CERTIFIED REPAIR FACILITY AND HAVE IT DONE RIGHT , " ONCE "

You could probably say most of this about anything anyone posts on the Repairs & Maintenance forum. Of course if someone hasn't looked at the car they're going to have a hard time giving more than an educated guess. But I think what we're trying to do is at least narrow the scope of the problem down. There are some very complicated things that could be wrong which require expensive equipment to fix (ie. compressor failure requiring refrigerant recovery & evac in order to replace) and some very simple things that could be wrong (ie. relay switch), stuff which does not require openning the refrigerant system up. If she has to take it to a mechanic, it'd be nice to know what kind of things the problem could be so there's no rip-off involved, because some mechanics can be quite unscrupulous.
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Old 08-13-2004, 11:07 AM   #14
JaneiR36
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Unfortunately, the manual I have is electrical only. (Turns out the whole thing wasn't $118, that was just for the mechanical repair manual, there was another one for electrical, and a third for automatic transmission or something....... and since I needed wiring diagrams............)

What they did mention in this one, though, is that the AC mag relay switch should be closed with the ignition, blower, and AC switches on. So far, the first two are definitely working. The third seems to be working from our readings, but something does get shut off.

They've also mentioned that the dual pressure switch would be "open with pressure 30 psi or above 384 psi." What does that mean, really? I'll look into renting the manifold gauges, but I'm already getting the general impression that the high side pressure is much higher than the low side. Maybe the estimation should help a little? The pressures don't seem to have equalized as originally thought.

petethegreek, while your suggestion is by no means original (yes, even on this thread!), I do seem to be nearing the end of my rope. If I don't have this diagnosed and fixed when it starts to cool off, I'll either shut down the project till next summer or just get it fixed professionally. Happy?
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Old 08-13-2004, 05:46 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JaneiR36
Unfortunately, the manual I have is electrical only. (Turns out the whole thing wasn't $118, that was just for the mechanical repair manual, there was another one for electrical, and a third for automatic transmission or something....... and since I needed wiring diagrams............)

What they did mention in this one, though, is that the AC mag relay switch should be closed with the ignition, blower, and AC switches on. So far, the first two are definitely working. The third seems to be working from our readings, but something does get shut off.

They've also mentioned that the dual pressure switch would be "open with pressure 30 psi or above 384 psi." What does that mean, really? I'll look into renting the manifold gauges, but I'm already getting the general impression that the high side pressure is much higher than the low side. Maybe the estimation should help a little? The pressures don't seem to have equalized as originally thought.

petethegreek, while your suggestion is by no means original (yes, even on this thread!), I do seem to be nearing the end of my rope. If I don't have this diagnosed and fixed when it starts to cool off, I'll either shut down the project till next summer or just get it fixed professionally. Happy?
Obviously high side pressure is high and low side pressure is low, that's where they get their names.


Quote:
"open with pressure 30 psi or above 384 psi." What does that mean, really?

OK - it's a switch as you know. If a switch is "open" it is off. If a switch is "closed" it is on. So if the pressure drops below 30PSI the switch will open (go off) or if it reaches pressures above 384 is will go open. Anything in between and the switch will be closed (on)

petethegreek, it is recommended R134A refridgerant be handled and used by a licenced person, but is not enforced nor is it the law. After all, R134A is used to blow out the keyboard your using which you can buy at any office supply shop. Since when do service shops do jobs "right"? If people never learn anything they will get ripped off their entire lives. I'd hate to pay a mechanic for every problem I had.
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