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Old 07-08-2003, 02:48 AM   #31
57ock
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopewite
I don't give a shit about cricket or rugby and I'm not even patriotic so you'd be flogging a dead horse there :|

You wouldn't want to be.
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Old 07-08-2003, 12:33 PM   #32
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57ock wrote -
"Einstein, that depends on what type of clutch and transmittion. Not the amount of cylinders you idoit"

Well it took you a while to suddenly decide to quote me on that post roll I agree with what you said about the kind of transmission being the main factor for a smooth gear change, but changing gear at a power peak of 7,000rpm won't be as smooth as changing gear at a power peak of 5,000rpm if both cars have virtually the same kind of transmission. As you floor the gas pedal at the end of a gear change, the power should go down more smoothly from a V8 than a 4-cylinder.

57ock wrote -
"So back to your magazine"

How can all my automotive knowledge come from one magazine? You're quite condesending aren't you P

57ock wrote -
"Dog Box doesn't have synchro"

Well I suppose that I did ask for a 'rough' explanation roll

57ock wrote -
"Good to see you aspire to a pick up the kids from school car
Lower and put a fully sick kit on it"

Being in the position to 'pick my children up from school' is another thing that I aspire to )
I never suggested that teen1216 put a bodykit on a Focus. I said, "You wouldn't have to do anything extreme" as in just going for grille and air dam mesh, multi-spoke 17" Ford Wheels, everything colour coded, factory spoiler, stainless steel exaust with a 3" tip etc. In my opinion, that would just be enough to make a Focus stand out in a good way when next to a run of the mill Focus.
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Old 07-08-2003, 01:48 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopewite
Well it took you a while to suddenly decide to quote me on that post I agree with what you said about the kind of transmission being the main factor for a smooth gear change, but changing gear at a power peak of 7,000rpm won't be as smooth as changing gear at a power peak of 5,000rpm if both cars have virtually the same kind of transmission. As you floor the gas pedal at the end of a gear change, the power should go down more smoothly from a V8 than a 4-cylinder.

snoopewite you type far too much.

Mates S/c 5.0ltr V8 Commodore pulls you harder back into the seat after 5,500rpm gear change then my car does. Even if my car is faster.
He has a shit load more torque then me. But there's another reason why. You can guess it Nothing to do with the transmittions or clutchs.

2.0ltr turbo / 5.0ltr s/c V8

Next Theory Old Chap
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Old 07-08-2003, 11:14 PM   #34
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I can only guess that the other reason that you're refering to is something to do with the gear ratios of each car.

Here's that next theory that you asked for mate ) arrow Changing gear is smoother up hill.
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Old 07-08-2003, 11:28 PM   #35
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uh oh... this is getting interesting...

:popcorn: anyone?

j/k
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Old 07-08-2003, 11:33 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopewite
I can only guess that the other reason that you're refering to is something to do with the gear ratios of each car.

Here's that next theory that you asked for mate :arrow: Changing gear is smoother up hill.

Nothing to do with transmittion which I stated.
Gave You a hint... Damn I'm far too nice to you

The difference between 2.0ltr Turbo Vs 5.0 S/c V8
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Old 07-09-2003, 01:44 AM   #37
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there was something wrong with this topic... didn't understand why but it's just disappeared... sorry about it...
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Old 07-09-2003, 04:16 AM   #38
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there was something wrong with this topic... didn't understand why but it's just disappeared... sorry about it...

!!!!!!!!!sabotage!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 07-09-2003, 04:46 AM   #39
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Anyway.

5.0ltr with a supercharger has a lot more torque. The S/c doesn't need the exhaust gases to spin the turbine. Its power/torque is instant. No need to spool the turbo.

A turbo needs the exhaust gases flowing fast enough to make boost.
But during a gear change the turbines in a turbo slow down, due to the limited flow of exhaust gases.

Once the exhaust gases are flowing fast enough again, the turbo is able to make boost whichs is the key to turbo cars power.
Instead of a instant power, you have a minor delay as the turbo spools into its efficency range to make boost. Smaller the turbo, the faster the spool.

So when your racing, the V8 gear changes aren't as smooth. They have instant power where the little 2ltr has to build up its power.
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Old 07-09-2003, 04:47 AM   #40
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But seriously. when your racing. WHO GIVES A SHIT IF YA GOT A SMOOTH GEAR CHANGE.

Thats the last thing that crosses my mind
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Old 07-09-2003, 10:58 AM   #41
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57ock wrote -
"Anyway.

5.0ltr with a supercharger has a lot more torque. The S/c doesn't need the exhaust gases to spin the turbine. Its power/torque is instant. No need to spool the turbo.

A turbo needs the exhaust gases flowing fast enough to make boost.
But during a gear change the turbines in a turbo slow down, due to the limited flow of exhaust gases.

Once the exhaust gases are flowing fast enough again, the turbo is able to make boost whichs is the key to turbo cars power.
Instead of a instant power, you have a minor delay as the turbo spools into its efficency range to make boost. Smaller the turbo, the faster the spool.

So when your racing, the V8 gear changes aren't as smooth. They have instant power where the little 2ltr has to build up its power."

You could have given me more time to reply. I had problems with my computer last night ( although I'll be getting a decent one next week D Now you'll never believe me when I say that I was going to say essentially what you said but without using as much text x
I don't suppose that it matters really. You've brought factors to this equation that I'd never have thought of, so I'm glad that I've grown a little bit from this disscussion )
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Old 08-24-2003, 12:10 AM   #42
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I’m back with a summary of the things that have been discussed in this topic mrgreen
The primary factor of a smooth gear change is the gearbox.
More cylinders give a smoother power delivery; turbos give smoother throttle response after changing gears and lower revving engines equate to a smoother gear change than higher revving engines. Generally, the slower the acceleration, the smoother the gear change. Changing gear up hill is smoother because more momentum is lost during gear change.
Lets have a look at 4 different hypothetical cars that are being driven by equally competent drivers that are participating in a 0-100mph sprint on a flat, smooth, dry tarmac surface -
1. A car that does 0-100mph in 10 seconds with a good gearbox; a 6-cylinder engine that redlines at 6,000rpm and 15psi turbo.
2. A car that does 0-100mph in 10 seconds with a good gearbox; a 4-cylinder engine that redlines at 8,000rpm and no forced induction.
Car number 1 would be smoother than car number 2 during the gear changes.
3. A car that does 0-100mph in 20 seconds with a good gearbox; a 4-cylinder engine that redlines at 8,000rpm and no forced induction.
Car number 3 would be smoother than car number 1 during the gear changes just because it’s a lot slower.
4. A car that does 0-100mph in 20 seconds with a bad gearbox; a 6-cylinder engine that redlines at 6,000rpm and a 15psi turbo.
Car number 4 wouldn’t even be as smooth as car number 2 during gear changes because of an inferior (not weaker but clunky) gearbox.
From the smoothest gear change to the worst it goes -
Car 3, car 1, car 2 and car 4.
I’m glad that it’s all rapped up now (please anyone correct me if I’m wrong).
We could always discuss launch technique next P
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Old 08-24-2003, 05:50 AM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by snoopewite
I’m back with a summary of the things that have been discussed in this topic
The primary factor of a smooth gear change is the gearbox.
More cylinders give a smoother power delivery; turbos give smoother throttle response after changing gears and lower revving engines equate to a smoother gear change than higher revving engines. Generally, the slower the acceleration, the smoother the gear change. Changing gear up hill is smoother because more momentum is lost during gear change.
Lets have a look at 4 different hypothetical cars that are being driven by equally competent drivers that are participating in a 0-100mph sprint on a flat, smooth, dry tarmac surface: -
1. A car that does 0-100mph in 10 seconds with a good gearbox; a 6-cylinder engine that redlines at 6,000rpm and 15psi turbo.
2. A car that does 0-100mph in 10 seconds with a good gearbox; a 4-cylinder engine that redlines at 8,000rpm and no forced induction.
Car number 1 would be smoother than car number 2 during the gear changes.
3. A car that does 0-100mph in 20 seconds with a good gearbox; a 4-cylinder engine that redlines at 8,000rpm and no forced induction.
Car number 3 would be smoother than car number 1 during the gear changes just because it’s a lot slower.
4. A car that does 0-100mph in 20 seconds with a bad gearbox; a 6-cylinder engine that redlines at 6,000rpm and a 15psi turbo.
Car number 4 wouldn’t even be as smooth as car number 2 during gear changes because of an inferior (not weaker but clunky) gearbox.
From the smoothest gear change to the worst it goes: -
Car 3, car 1, car 2 and car 4.
I’m glad that it’s all rapped up now (please anyone correct me if I’m wrong).
We could always discuss launch technique next :P

I don't want to do this but my fingers have a mind of their own.

The two primary factors in a smooth gear change are flywheel inertia and the drivers ability to match engine speed to transmission speed. To say that the number of cylinders, aspiration or anything else is a factor is ludicrous. Of course that is assuming that the gearboxes are of equal mechanical quality. You have to have one constant in any hypothetical situation of this sort.

And Snoope, unless that's short fo Snoop Doggy Dog I'm thinking you meant to wrap it up.
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Old 08-24-2003, 03:51 PM   #44
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i thought i knew a little bit about cars but damn i cant keep up with u people i understans alot of it but the other half is just looks like crazy talk (no offence its me with the problem ) but .... i forget what the point of this post was.....ohh yea after being to this fourms you people have opened my eyes to just how little i know hehe in a way thats a good thing so thank you (i think)
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Old 08-25-2003, 12:30 AM   #45
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vwhobo wrote -
“The two primary factors in a smooth gear change are flywheel inertia and the drivers ability to match engine speed to transmission speed. To say that the number of cylinders, aspiration or anything else is a factor is ludicrous. Of course that is assuming that the gearboxes are of equal mechanical quality. You have to have one constant in any hypothetical situation of this sort.”

By the inertia of the flywheel do you mean how heavy it is, which affects how quickly the revs rise and fall? By matching engine speed to transmission speed, do you mean how much the accelerator is pressed when the clutch is completely let off ?

vwhobo wrote -
“And Snoope, unless that's short fo Snoop Doggy Dog I'm thinking you meant to wrap it up.”

No it’s not short “fo” “Snoop Doggy Dog” or even “Snoop Dog” for that matter. You’re right though; I did mean to ‘wrap’ it up lol

Btw, are you going to reply to me in the topic titled “Lets play a game”?
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