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Old 10-18-2006, 03:23 AM   #1
AndersonBraun
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Soupe Up an old bug

hi i'm 16 and getting a car. i want a classic i can afford-u know something cheap. i don't care if it looks pretty-i just want some power. i was thinking about puuting a turbo in a 1974 standard bug. what else can i do? how musch horsepower will the turbo get me? (standard hp for an old standard bug is roughly 40hp). any suggestions are welcomed. thanks
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Old 10-18-2006, 03:33 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndersonBraun
hi i'm 16 and getting a car. i want a classic i can afford-u know something cheap. i don't care if it looks pretty-i just want some power. i was thinking about puuting a turbo in a 1974 standard bug. what else can i do? how musch horsepower will the turbo get me? (standard hp for an old standard bug is roughly 40hp). any suggestions are welcomed. thanks
Hanging a turbo off the back of a 32 year old stock 1600 will get you a pile of hot, oily, broken broken parts... In a big hurry. And it won't be cheap. It sounds to me like you need to start with a good basic rebuild including some slip-in 87's, dual Kads, 1.25 ratio rockers, 009 distributor with an electronic conversion and an 1.5" extractor with with a quiet muffler. Then drive it for a while to learn the proper care and feeding of an ACVW while you collect some money for further upgrades.
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Old 10-18-2006, 02:43 PM   #3
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Don't turbos put a lot of wear on the engine? :\
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Old 10-18-2006, 04:49 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
Don't turbos put a lot of wear on the engine? :\
Depends on boost...But yeah, it does shorten the lifespan.
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Old 10-18-2006, 05:45 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by chris_knows
Depends on boost...But yeah, it does shorten the lifespan.
Then can you explain how turbocharged engines regularly go 500k mile between rebuilds? Or did you just hit submit BEFORE thinking?
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Old 10-18-2006, 05:53 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by vwhobo
Then can you explain how turbocharged engines regularly go 500k mile between rebuilds? Or did you just hit submit BEFORE thinking?
So turbocharged engines last longer than N/A engines? lol
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Old 10-18-2006, 06:48 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by chris_knows
So turbocharged engines last longer than N/A engines? lol
I'm not exactly sure where I said that. There are far too many variables involved to make a blanket statement that turbo engines last longer than N/A engines, or to reverse that statement. Unfortunately, not everything is as black and white as many people would like to believe, apparently including you.

I think if you'll read my first post in this thread, you'll see that I implied exactly the opposite. Why? Well, because any 30+ year old engine in a cheap project car has probably seen better times. The main bearing saddles are probably beat out of round and beyond machinable specs, the valve springs probably have somewhere near a zillion cycles on them, etc. More importantly, that engine as it sits IS NOT designed or built for the extra heat, stress and probable RPM that would come from a 16 year old kid driving a turbo Bug. Hell, the engine in the car might not last as it is with a heavy footed teenager behind the wheel. That is common sense and experience speaking.

On the other hand, an engine that is designed and built specifically with the intended purpose of being turbocharged, properly maintained, yada yada can well last 500k miles and even more. Again it's that variable thing the individuals with just enough knowledge to be dangerous don't understand or maybe even care about.
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Old 10-18-2006, 07:28 PM   #8
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Wouldn't it be cheaper to put a newer and better engine in, if possible?

Probably would be much more powerful than if you turboed a 40hp engine...
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Old 10-18-2006, 07:40 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vwhobo
I'm not exactly sure where I said that. There are far too many variables involved to make a blanket statement that turbo engines last longer than N/A engines, or to reverse that statement. Unfortunately, not everything is as black and white as many people would like to believe, apparently including you.

I think if you'll read my first post in this thread, you'll see that I implied exactly the opposite. Why? Well, because any 30+ year old engine in a cheap project car has probably seen better times. The main bearing saddles are probably beat out of round and beyond machinable specs, the valve springs probably have somewhere near a zillion cycles on them, etc. More importantly, that engine as it sits IS NOT designed or built for the extra heat, stress and probable RPM that would come from a 16 year old kid driving a turbo Bug. Hell, the engine in the car might not last as it is with a heavy footed teenager behind the wheel. That is common sense and experience speaking.

On the other hand, an engine that is designed and built specifically with the intended purpose of being turbocharged, properly maintained, yada yada can well last 500k miles and even more. Again it's that variable thing the individuals with just enough knowledge to be dangerous don't understand or maybe even care about.
Gotcha lol.
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Old 10-18-2006, 09:33 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
Wouldn't it be cheaper to put a newer and better engine in, if possible?

Probably would be much more powerful than if you turboed a 40hp engine...
Well... yeah... but... For starters the '74 Bug didn't come with a 40 horse engine. The last year for the 40 horse to be imported to the USA was 1965, and while possible, it's very unlikely that an earlier engine was retrofitted into a later car. Additionally, if you recall my first post here, I recommended a basic rebuild as the first step in his process, which by the way, he seems to have no interest in.

Just to improve your knowledge of ACVW trivia, the 1200 cc 40 horse and the 1600 60 horse (what his car came with stock) are essentially the same engine, at least from an architectural and material standpoint. That basic engine can be built and made to live developing up to about 400 hp (not a typo, four zero zero) on the street. Granted, it takes a lot more parts than on my list above and it has to be built right, but it can be done. Maybe more surprising is that there are LOTS of VW's out there right now running 250+ hp, on the street without nitrous.
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Old 10-19-2006, 01:30 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vwhobo
Well... yeah... but... For starters the '74 Bug didn't come with a 40 horse engine. The last year for the 40 horse to be imported to the USA was 1965, and while possible, it's very unlikely that an earlier engine was retrofitted into a later car. Additionally, if you recall my first post here, I recommended a basic rebuild as the first step in his process, which by the way, he seems to have no interest in.

Just to improve your knowledge of ACVW trivia, the 1200 cc 40 horse and the 1600 60 horse (what his car came with stock) are essentially the same engine, at least from an architectural and material standpoint. That basic engine can be built and made to live developing up to about 400 hp (not a typo, four zero zero) on the street. Granted, it takes a lot more parts than on my list above and it has to be built right, but it can be done. Maybe more surprising is that there are LOTS of VW's out there right now running 250+ hp, on the street without nitrous.

With a car that light...it'd be like driving an ariel atom :O
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Old 10-19-2006, 04:18 PM   #12
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i've posted it once before and i'll post it again. www.volksrods.com i am currently looking for a bug so i can build one close to the "rat patrol".
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Old 10-19-2006, 04:31 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by glagon1979
i've posted it once before and i'll post it again. www.volksrods.com i am currently looking for a bug so i can build one close to the "rat patrol".
And how exactly does posting a link to this website answer his question? The answer is it doesn't. I wonder if linking to another forum for no good reason could be considered spamming?
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Old 10-19-2006, 05:16 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
Don't turbos put a lot of wear on the engine? :\
It depends how you drive. If you only spool the turbo to 5psi once in a while, when the (wastegate?) limits it to 15, you should be OK. If you are at a good 14PSi on a daily basis, it wont be the same.
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Old 10-20-2006, 05:57 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vwhobo
I wonder if linking to another forum for no good reason could be considered spamming?

Only if you were teh owner or bot of that site, and were posting for the first time (or were very new at posting). Spam has intent: to sell. Glagon is neither an owner of that site nor a bot (as far as I can tell), nor is trying to sell us anything.

I'd say no to spam OR advertising in this case. Now, me linking to my CafePress T-shirt design site is definitely advertising, which is why I won't do it.
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