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Old 10-26-2006, 02:49 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glagon1979
but back to topic, i would own one for that price.

Great new yorkers think alike
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Old 10-26-2006, 04:00 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
Great new yorkers think alike

i wouldnt go that far , my boss bought a 99 esprit and that thing is stupid fast!!!!!!! 3/4 throttle had me fighting to keep my head upright!!! the nice thing is he only spent $20k on the car and could easily double his money if he were to resell it.
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Old 10-26-2006, 06:05 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by glagon1979
i wouldnt go that far , my boss bought a 99 esprit and that thing is stupid fast!!!!!!! 3/4 throttle had me fighting to keep my head upright!!! the nice thing is he only spent $20k on the car and could easily double his money if he were to resell it.

Hmmph you're not a real new yorker anyways
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Old 10-26-2006, 07:54 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monsta
What Ferrari will it smoke? Name ONE.


That weak ass Toyota engine isn't enough to make me pay $40,000+ for a stupidly small, stupidly uncomfortable Lotus.
You think that's weak? You guys didn't have to endure the literally weak K-series Rover engine they once had here in the UK.....Headgasket and waterpumps seemed to fail between fuel stops....
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Old 10-26-2006, 08:05 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
Ferrari has been coming out with "luxurious", over-weight, passenger cars, like the 612 scaglietti.
What other luxurious "passenger" cars have Ferrari produced? And don't be stupid, the Scaglietti would defeat the Elise on all but the smallest, twistiest tracks.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
And the only porsche models that even accelerate faster are the 911 carrera S's, 911 turbo and gt3, all priced MUCH higher.You see my point, and this isn't even including performance. It runs a 71.6 in a slalom test...that's .2 sec faster than a porsche carrera 4s, a car that costs twice as much.
The only Porsches that an Elise can out-accelerate on non-race spec tires are the non-turbo Cayenne and base Boxster. Oh, and that's going to 60 mph. After 60 mph when the inertia conquering advantage is over the Elise's acceleration drops off considerably. I'd also like to add that you think like a child. The Porsche Carrera and Lotus Elise have 2 seperate agendas. The Elise is a pure weekend track day. The Elise doesn't have the powerband, AWD, comforts, reliability, and I repeat comforts of the Carrera 4S. And the Carrera will probably still beat it at the track.

Oh and fyi, acceleration is a performance figure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
I don't know how much you value should be placed on a car because of its engine, but what about engineering and design? Lotus engineering isn't like any other, it's very unique...Even the sports package decreases 0-60 time by .2 secs...that's amazing. How many cars can you name that have a performance option (other than engine option) that increase the acceleration by that much?
The performance option for the Elise includes those f*ck-you-in-the-rain race spec tires I've been mentioning...of course acceleration will increase. Lotus Engineering...hmm. Light weight+stiff suspension. That about sums it up. Lotus has produced a creative universal chassis design though. But as far as the light weight stiff suspension thing goes, other manufactures exist that do it lighter and stiffer.

The engine in my sports car is very important to me. That bitch engine in the Lotus breaks a helluva lot because of the stress you have to put on it to get manufacturer claimed performance figures. Exciting acceleration in an Elise stops at 60 mph. And if you want 0-60 mph in 5 seconds, you will be dropping the clutch at 6400 rpm. How long will it last...
The Elise's powerband sucks as expected. But you don't know anything about that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
Ok, so what car would you suggest for the same price?
Some cars that accomplish the weekend trackday task better than the Elise are: Caterham Superlight R400, Ariel Atom 220, Factory Five Racing GTM Mulsanne, Factory Five Racing Type 65 Coupe...etc...etc. All of these cars produce better all around performance figures than the Elise.

Some small cars that I'd choose over the Elise:
Porsche Boxster/Cayman
Corvette
350z
G35 Coupe
BMW 335 Coupe

They won't have the handling prestige of the Elise, but all of these cars will provide a more comforting, more reliable ride and better REAL WORLD acceleration.

Here is an article of the Exige being dominated on a track by a Cayman. http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...tus-exige.html


Here is a video of a STOCK previous model Corvette defeating a RACE PREPPED...I repeat...RACE PREPPED Lotus Elise. Race prepped means more than just the cheating tires.
http://www.ifilm.com/ifilmdetail/2676641

Last edited by Monsta : 10-26-2006 at 08:08 PM.
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Old 10-26-2006, 09:28 PM   #36
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i take it ou dont really like the Lotus Elise!!!!
its a great car to drive (or in my case, ride around in) and its a great car to whizz round a track!
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Old 10-26-2006, 09:37 PM   #37
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to monsta:
no wonder you have been banned so many times. who pisses in your wheaties everyday?? why cant you just accept the fact that he likes the car and no matter what you say he is going to come back with something that backs his likes about the car. its pointless to rant and rave about how good/bad a car is. you can voice your opinion, but it should stop there. i have been guilty in the past of that same thing, but i became open minded and dont care anymore. ok, i vented, now i'll just sit back and wait for you to "shame" me (like you said you were going to do months ago), k peanut?

Last edited by glagon1979 : 10-26-2006 at 09:44 PM.
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Old 10-26-2006, 09:56 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glagon1979
to monsta:
no wonder you have been banned so many times. who pisses in your wheaties everyday?? why cant you just accept the fact that he likes the car and no matter what you say he is going to come back with something that backs his likes about the car. its pointless to rant and rave about how good/bad a car is. you can voice your opinion, but it should stop there. i have been guilty in the past of that same thing, but i became open minded and dont care anymore. ok, i vented, now i'll just sit back and wait for you to "shame" me (like you said you were going to do months ago), k peanut?
thats a better response to what you wrote before you edited!!!
i totally agree with you!
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Old 10-26-2006, 10:23 PM   #39
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I love Lotus for what they have achieved in motorsport and for their cars. The Elise would make a great track car and yet you wouldn't out of place on the road compared to a Se7en.
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Old 10-26-2006, 10:42 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monsta
..........

Poor mid-range torque means you will have to thrash the engine to get decent performance.........


How do you mean thrash the engine? What constitutes thrashing said motor? What, in your view, is decent performance... please quantify?
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Old 10-26-2006, 11:23 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glagon1979
no wonder you have been banned so many times. who pisses in your wheaties everyday?? why cant you just accept the fact that he likes the car and no matter what you say he is going to come back with something that backs his likes about the car. its pointless to rant and rave about how good/bad a car is. you can voice your opinion, but it should stop there. i have been guilty in the past of that same thing...
How dare you compare yourself to I. You are an emotional being. I am a cold calculated beast. I do not care if I change his mind. I do not care that he likes the Elise. I understand that he likes the Elise and I don't. I am not trying to make him I. That would be an absurd attempt. No one pisses in my Wheaties. I am not angry. Did I appear angry? Did I go beyond voicing my opinion? I don't believe so because I am I and I understand what I am not feeling. But if my post was as emotional as you thought it to be...ban me for it?

Shut the fuck up.

Last edited by Monsta : 10-26-2006 at 11:31 PM. Reason: So True Brit will like me.
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Old 10-27-2006, 01:21 AM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monsta
What other luxurious "passenger" cars have Ferrari produced? And don't be stupid, the Scaglietti would defeat the Elise on all but the smallest, twistiest tracks.

I seem to recall you asking me to name one. And if you were wondering, I was referring to some slightly older mid 90s ferraris but since you asked I gave you a new one. The 4100 lb scaglietti would defeat the lotus on all but the twistiest of tracks? No. Sorry, it wouldn't, even though the 0-60 time is .2 seconds faster, it wouldn't be able to handle what the lotus could. So don't be stupid


Quote:
The only Porsches that an Elise can out-accelerate on non-race spec tires are the non-turbo Cayenne and base Boxster. Oh, and that's going to 60 mph. After 60 mph when the inertia conquering advantage is over the Elise's acceleration drops off considerably. I'd also like to add that you think like a child. The Porsche Carrera and Lotus Elise have 2 seperate agendas. The Elise is a pure weekend track day. The Elise doesn't have the powerband, AWD, comforts, reliability, and I repeat comforts of the Carrera 4S. And the Carrera will probably still beat it at the track.

Even if you choose the non race spec tires, it still out accelerates the carrera cabriolet and carrera 4 cabriolet. Add the sports package or 'racing tires' (which I test drove with btw) and it outdoes ALL porsches excluding the 911 turbo, 911 gt3 and carrera 4s coupe, and that's by .1 second. So basically we're talking about a variancy of about .2 seconds here between all those porsches and this lotus. Not bad for such a crappy car.

Mind you, it accelerates plenty fast after 60mph.

And it's not a pure weekend track day car. It's just as comfortable, or as uncomfortable rather, as a porsche boxster or cayman. I suppose those are week end day cars, too? And people don't pay 80-100 grand for carreras for the "comforts", they pay for the exceptional performance and speed, excellent engineering and high quality parts. There aren't even many comforts in it if you're talking about luxury or convenience here. Oh, and let me remind you that it beats the carrera 4s in the slalom. Again, not bad for a car that costs half as much.

Quote:
Oh and fyi, acceleration is a performance figure.

No shit.

Quote:
The performance option for the Elise includes those f*ck-you-in-the-rain race spec tires I've been mentioning...of course acceleration will increase. Lotus Engineering...hmm. Light weight+stiff suspension. That about sums it up. Lotus has produced a creative universal chassis design though. But as far as the light weight stiff suspension thing goes, other manufactures exist that do it lighter and stiffer.

I have researched a lot on lotus, the company and its history. There are even suspension options in the track pack if I wanted where I can get an adjustible suspension...and bilstein shocks and some other stuff.

Quote:
The engine in my sports car is very important to me. That bitch engine in the Lotus breaks a helluva lot because of the stress you have to put on it to get manufacturer claimed performance figures. Exciting acceleration in an Elise stops at 60 mph. And if you want 0-60 mph in 5 seconds, you will be dropping the clutch at 6400 rpm. How long will it last...
The Elise's powerband sucks as expected. But you don't know anything about that.
I've read a lot of reviews and I've never seen anyone say it broke but surely I'll check more. And as I've said, the exciting accelerations continues all the way to...well, as I've said I only went up to 110, but it didn't seem like it was gonna stop there.

It doesn't matter in this car if the power band sucks, but you wouldn't know anything about that.



Quote:
Some cars that accomplish the weekend trackday task better than the Elise are: Caterham Superlight R400, Ariel Atom 220, Factory Five Racing GTM Mulsanne, Factory Five Racing Type 65 Coupe...etc...etc. All of these cars produce better all around performance figures than the Elise.

I don't go to the track on week ends nor do I intend to. I went to the lotus dealership to see if it was practical to use for every day driving, and I have found that IT IS. You must not have ever driven one.

Quote:
Some small cars that I'd choose over the Elise:
Porsche Boxster/Cayman
Corvette
350z
G35 Coupe
BMW 335 Coupe

They won't have the handling prestige of the Elise, but all of these cars will provide a more comforting, more reliable ride and better REAL WORLD acceleration.

Only cars I would consider over a lotus there are the boxster/cayman...and that's only in the S version.

[quote[Here is an article of the Exige being dominated on a track by a Cayman. http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...tus-exige.html


Here is a video of a STOCK previous model Corvette defeating a RACE PREPPED...I repeat...RACE PREPPED Lotus Elise. Race prepped means more than just the cheating tires.
http://www.ifilm.com/ifilmdetail/2676641[/quote]

I've driven BOTH and the cayman and/or boxster feels way inferior to the lotus, and no this was not on a track.

Let's just look at cars in the same PRICE RANGE as a lotus, rather than comparing them to carreras and ferraris. This is what I know off the top of my head.

BMW z4 si roadster: Substantially worse at accelerating. Cramped inside. Pretty nice interior. Light enough.

Price: 42,000 base...

Rating: 8.75/10

Porsche boxster: Substantially worse at accelerating. Not exactly comfortable compared to the lotus. Many plastic parts on the interior :\ Super light weight is good. Rear mounted engine owns.

Price: 46,000

Rating: 8.75/10

Mercedes slk350: Doesn't accelerate nearly as well. VERY cramped inside. Slightly cheap interior, for a mercedes. Retractable hardtop is nice feature. Kind of heavy compared to the others.

Price: 49,000

Rating: 8.25/10



Nissan 350z convertible: Worse at accelerating. Not very nice on the inside. I don't know about how it feels, I've never driven one.

Price: 35,000

Rating: N/A

Audi tt 3.2l roadster: Substantially slower. Not fun to drive at all. Has quattro.

Price: 43k.

Rating: 7/10

Chrysler crossfire: Faster than the rest. Ugly as hell. Cheap ass interior. Reluctant to buy because of all the crappy ass reviews (dozens) on the sebring.

Price: 49k

rating: N/A

Lotus elise: Faster than ALL of these in 0-60 time. Exceptional handling. The interior IS actually nice. Shitty ass sound system. Exceptional handling. Real driver-car interaction. EXCLUSIVITY. Like I said earlier, where I live, EVERYONE is driving a porsche, bmw...especially 350z's lol. Hard to get into.

Price: 43k

Rating: 9/10


Basically what I am saying is, compared to competing vehicles, the lotus, in my opinion, is the best bargain for the money.


I don't know why you're so bitter over lotuses..
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Old 10-27-2006, 02:59 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by Bronxie
Let's just look at cars in the same PRICE RANGE as a lotus, rather than comparing them to carreras and ferraris.
I'm not comparing the Elise to Ferraris and Carreras, you are. 0-60 mph isn't as powerful as you lead you to believe. What is an Elise's 30-50 mph? 50-70? Wait, I've found those stats. It reads: terrible.

Does that quarter mile say 13.9 seconds? What? The Lotus isn't about acceleration, yes I know. But what it is about, other cars are about it better while retaining acceleration.

Last edited by Monsta : 10-27-2006 at 03:02 AM.
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Old 10-27-2006, 03:17 AM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Monsta
I'm not comparing the Elise to Ferraris and Carreras, you are. 0-60 mph isn't as powerful as you lead you to believe. What is an Elise's 30-50 mph? 50-70? Wait, I've found those stats. It reads: terrible.

Does that quarter mile say 13.9 seconds? What? The Lotus isn't about acceleration, yes I know. But what it is about, other cars are about it better while retaining acceleration.


You only go 0-60 once really (usually) during a test drive...I am pleased with the entire experience. I think that says a lot. Anyways I loved it...and before I make my FINAL decision, I'll go try those other cars so I can give you better reason as to why they aren't as good, or maybe they will be as good. Shrug.

Anyways I will go test drive an M roadster...see if that's better for more dough.
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Old 10-27-2006, 05:04 AM   #45
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the elise is a great car. considering the weight of the vehicle, the 2zz-ge pushes it very well. extremely agile car as well.

to asnwer whats question of "name one ferrari it will smoke, i will name several
-250gt
-365gt4
-308gts
-328gts
-330gtc
-400gt
-246gts
and numerous others. what myfriend, you have been prooved wrong. how does that feel?

on another note,
bronxie, how do you go on test drives? with cars like those, salesmen, and managers dont just let people drive their cars unless they are pretty sure that youre buying.
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