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Old 01-29-2007, 08:14 PM   #61
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris_knows
If you want to know why it's 65ms and not 30, then check out this website. It's from 2003, and BMW claims that their new SMG's are about 20% quicker. On that site, it says that shifts can take as little as 80 milliseconds. That means that since shifts take 80% of the time, shifts with an SMG can take as little as 64ms...
Are your feet tired from tap dancing yet? The question is why is 65 milliseconds the ideal shift time? That is all. I don't care what BMW said four years ago or how much they've been improved. The question is simple and straightforward. Answer it.
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Old 01-29-2007, 08:30 PM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vwhobo
Are your feet tired from tap dancing yet? The question is why is 65 milliseconds the ideal shift time? That is all. I don't care what BMW said four years ago or how much they've been improved. The question is simple and straightforward. Answer it.
I already said it's because that's about as fast as the average person can move the shifter...
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Old 01-29-2007, 08:39 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chris_knows
I already said it's because that's about as fast as the average person can move the shifter...
You're still tap dancing and not paying attention. We're not talking about how fast a person can move a shifter, we're talking about how fast the SMG can shift. That fact has already been addressed at least once. For some reason you seem to keep waffling about and confusing the two. "SMG" and "person" only have one of the same letters so this shouldn't be too hard. And no person can shift in .065 seconds. Nobody.

Once again, what makes .065 seconds an ideal shift time?
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Old 01-29-2007, 08:43 PM   #64
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vwhobo
You're still tap dancing and not paying attention. We're not talking about how fast a person can move a shifter, we're talking about how fast the SMG can shift. That fact has already been addressed at least once. For some reason you seem to keep waffling about and confusing the two. "SMG" and "person" only have one of the same letters so this shouldn't be too hard. And no person can shift in .065 seconds. Nobody.

Once again, what makes .065 seconds an ideal shift time?
So it takes .065 seconds for the computer to process the information and actually change gears?
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Old 01-29-2007, 08:56 PM   #65
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Originally Posted by chris_knows
So it takes .065 seconds for the computer to process the information and actually change gears?
Probably, but that's just another question. We're looking for your answer to what makes .065 seconds an ideal shift time? Remember?
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Old 01-29-2007, 08:58 PM   #66
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Originally Posted by vwhobo
Not an alias, just someone who works for me who was logged in when I typed the reply. The phone rang, I walked away and when I came back hit submit without realizing my mistake.
That answers that one then, lol. I thought it was either you or 'What'....Just me jumpin' the gun slightly

As for shifting in .65sec....I can see how that would be impossible, unless you're a computer
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Old 01-29-2007, 09:06 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vwhobo
Probably, but that's just another question. We're looking for your answer to what makes .065 seconds an ideal shift time? Remember?
I think we just proved that I was wrong lol. I guess the ideal shift would be around .165 seconds (or whatever amount of time it takes a person to move their hand 5cm).
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Old 01-29-2007, 09:32 PM   #68
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I don't know why I like manuals. Maybe cause it's still relatively new to me.

Most autos lag while it decides what gear to go into, when you hit the pedal hard.

I know not ALL autos do that, but in most 10-50k cars, that is the case, and it bothers me.

I drove a new BMW 335i and all they had was an auto, and it was pretty laggy when you hit the pedal, and this was from like 30mph.


EDIT: And most autos weigh a lot. I don't want the extra weight on my car.
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Old 01-29-2007, 09:40 PM   #69
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Originally Posted by Bronxie
I don't know why I like manuals. Maybe cause it's still relatively new to me.

Most autos lag while it decides what gear to go into, when you hit the pedal hard.

I know not ALL autos do that, but in most 10-50k cars, that is the case, and it bothers me.

I drove a new BMW 335i and all they had was an auto, and it was pretty laggy when you hit the pedal, and this was from like 30mph.


EDIT: And most autos weigh a lot. I don't want the extra weight on my car.
There are autos that shift faster than manuals, but most "lag" because they were designed to provide a more comfortable ride.
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Old 01-29-2007, 10:33 PM   #70
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
I don't know why I like manuals. Maybe cause it's still relatively new to me.

Most autos lag while it decides what gear to go into, when you hit the pedal hard.

They are designed as luxury items, so they shift smoothly, not quickly, from teh factory in most modern cases.

Quote:
EDIT: And most autos weigh a lot. I don't want the extra weight on my car.

The average automatic is maybe 25-50 lbs more than a manual. In a 3500+ lb luxury, or semi luxury car, what percentage is that? Eating less pizza and being less fat would be more of a difference as far as the car is concerned. In fact, in many cases, the auto is no heavier. Why? While the torque converter may add weight, so does the flywheel for a manual trans car, balancing that difference out. the AOD automatic I put in my Ford powered RX7 weighed in at 125 lbs. Guess how much a T5 manual with bellhousing would weigh for that same application...
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Old 01-29-2007, 11:24 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisV
They are designed as luxury items, so they shift smoothly, not quickly, from teh factory in most modern cases.



The average automatic is maybe 25-50 lbs more than a manual. In a 3500+ lb luxury, or semi luxury car, what percentage is that? Eating less pizza and being less fat would be more of a difference as far as the car is concerned. In fact, in many cases, the auto is no heavier. Why? While the torque converter may add weight, so does the flywheel for a manual trans car, balancing that difference out. the AOD automatic I put in my Ford powered RX7 weighed in at 125 lbs. Guess how much a T5 manual with bellhousing would weigh for that same application...

For a boxster, the tiptronic weighs about 90 lbs more.


In a 3500 lb luxury car, you aren't trying to maximize power efficiency through low weight, but lower weight is always better for the driver if it doesn't compromise what they are expecting out of the car (price, conveniences)

I'd take a 335i stripped down (street legal) just because I know it would be more enjoyable for me. All the other crap I want, like stereo head unit, heated seats...I can make a little ghetto after-market fix for one and I'll be fine




So it's all about preference.



That being said, I drove into the Bronx today to pick up some chick and I got lost, driving around in circles. It WAS annoying as hell. Clutch got too much work, but had I not gotten lost, it would have been tolerable.
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Old 01-30-2007, 07:50 PM   #72
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Incase anybody was wondering why this thread looks slightly different, it's because I deleted all of the recent 'bickering' posts from it...
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Old 01-30-2007, 09:22 PM   #73
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Incase anybody was wondering why this thread looks slightly different, it's because I deleted all of the recent 'bickering' posts from it...

Do you prefer auto or manual?
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Old 01-30-2007, 09:31 PM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bronxie
Do you prefer auto or manual?
Manual.....
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Old 01-30-2007, 11:03 PM   #75
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cliffy
Manual.....

thats the only way to go
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