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Old 10-23-2007, 12:52 AM   #1
dvdrose18
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GM outsells Toyota?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/business/7055778.stm
In an attempt to bring CF back on topic, I raise these questions. Is GM making a global comeback, or are they just slowing their retreat? Their sales in the states are still slipping, will/can they ever recover? What do they need to do different? No flame wars please
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Old 10-23-2007, 12:58 AM   #2
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In the UK, GM is responsible for Vauxhall and Chevrolet mainly, and I can see why it's the world leader, what with so many names under it. I can only see them going from strength to strength over here!
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Old 10-23-2007, 02:19 AM   #3
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Part of that sucess can be because they control more than 1 manufacturer...a lot actually

Pontiac
Saturn
Chevrolet
GMC
Cadillac
Ford
Hummer (i believe)
Vauxhaul
Opel (i believe)

Together they are bound to sell more than Toyota which owns

Toyota
Lexus
has a part of Subaru, im not sure whats going on with that
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Old 10-23-2007, 02:24 AM   #4
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As Cliffy said, it seems globally GM is better than they are in their own country. I've heard a lot of talk about them trying to nail the Asian market, but sometimes it's hard to say whats fact and whats speculation on that.

In America there will always be a market for GM as there will always be die-hard GM buyers. I think they need to shrink their output some more to tip the supply/demand ratio, and they need to work out better deals with the UAW. I'm guessing thats part of the reason why they are more successful overseas.
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Old 10-23-2007, 02:40 AM   #5
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GM and Ford have better cars overseas.

Buick is the shizzle in China, and Ford seems to be the shizzle everywhere but in USA. European Focus is hot...ter than ours.
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Old 10-23-2007, 04:02 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newyorker
Part of that sucess can be because they control more than 1 manufacturer...a lot actually

Ford

Say what?
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Old 10-23-2007, 05:25 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by jedimario
Say what?
Well I just started naming the things out of my head so sorry. I think GM needs to rethink some things they are doing. For one, I would scrap the hummer, I dont see many of them around, and with gas prices and the general financial situation of many people in the US..well that might be why.
I have to agree with What on this one though. Cars in europe seem to be better than they are here, in many ways. I think that if GM takes more time to realize that more people are changing over to economy cars, and not put so much effort into big SUVs like the explorer, expedition, etc. they would do better. The ford Edge crossover I like just fine. Saturn (Opel) did a great job with the Aura here in the US, I for one really like the car. However, GM as a whole in my mind needs to expand a bit. They need to start thinking of new cars that can match the import and european rivals. Honda has the civic Si, VW has the GLI and GTI, I cant think of any domestic car except the cobalt SS/SC (are they still being made btw?) to match or surpass the compatition.
However, I think GM makes their cars different for the US because of the majority market they are trying to sell to. When Europeans think of america, they think overweight, lazy, blue collar people, and I think this is the market that GM is mainly trying to gear towards. If they expanded their market to say a younger audience, or people with more money by making new cars or refining and redesigning their existing models, they would see a large increase in sales, not to mention that a lot of people (myself included) have this idea that GM quality is not up to par with the competition. Of course its easy for me to sit here and talk about it rather than if I was in charge of GM or had some control or say in their desicions, I would know that market studies, and so forth cost a lot of money...I know this either way but its easier to say something than do it in most cases, and this is one of those. A luxury car company like cadillac is known for luxury, in fact thats what I think of before Mercedes Benz, but their cars seem to be geared for older people. If they could find a way to make their cars more appealing to middle aged people, and raise quality a bit, and make the cars more refined, Acura and Lexus might have some competition. Then again with the increase in cost of making a car, the price would rise as well, so they may not be at the same level as Acura and Lexus. Its a confusing area, and something that GM need to figure out. The corporation will likely never go out of business, becuase as was said, there will always be die-hard american car buyers, but they will continiue to decline in sales. I remember some years ago that Oldsmobile was going out of business, or it was a rumor I heard, I dont know whats happening or happened with that if anyone can fill me in, thanks.
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Old 10-23-2007, 07:57 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newyorker
Well I just started naming the things out of my head so sorry. I think GM needs to rethink some things they are doing. For one, I would scrap the hummer, I dont see many of them around, and with gas prices and the general financial situation of many people in the US..well that might be why.
I have to agree with What on this one though. Cars in europe seem to be better than they are here, in many ways. I think that if GM takes more time to realize that more people are changing over to economy cars, and not put so much effort into big SUVs like the explorer, expedition, etc. they would do better. The ford Edge crossover I like just fine. Saturn (Opel) did a great job with the Aura here in the US, I for one really like the car. However, GM as a whole in my mind needs to expand a bit. They need to start thinking of new cars that can match the import and european rivals. Honda has the civic Si, VW has the GLI and GTI, I cant think of any domestic car except the cobalt SS/SC (are they still being made btw?) to match or surpass the compatition.
However, I think GM makes their cars different for the US because of the majority market they are trying to sell to. When Europeans think of america, they think overweight, lazy, blue collar people, and I think this is the market that GM is mainly trying to gear towards. If they expanded their market to say a younger audience, or people with more money by making new cars or refining and redesigning their existing models, they would see a large increase in sales, not to mention that a lot of people (myself included) have this idea that GM quality is not up to par with the competition. Of course its easy for me to sit here and talk about it rather than if I was in charge of GM or had some control or say in their desicions, I would know that market studies, and so forth cost a lot of money...I know this either way but its easier to say something than do it in most cases, and this is one of those. A luxury car company like cadillac is known for luxury, in fact thats what I think of before Mercedes Benz, but their cars seem to be geared for older people. If they could find a way to make their cars more appealing to middle aged people, and raise quality a bit, and make the cars more refined, Acura and Lexus might have some competition. Then again with the increase in cost of making a car, the price would rise as well, so they may not be at the same level as Acura and Lexus. Its a confusing area, and something that GM need to figure out. The corporation will likely never go out of business, becuase as was said, there will always be die-hard american car buyers, but they will continiue to decline in sales. I remember some years ago that Oldsmobile was going out of business, or it was a rumor I heard, I dont know whats happening or happened with that if anyone can fill me in, thanks.
First off, you don't see a lot of Hummers because they're a niche vehicle. It's not necissarily that they aren't selling, you aren't seeing many because GM is doing what they should be doing with all there cars by not overflowing a declining market with them.

GM tried the small sporty car for kids with the Cobalt SS SC. Not a bad car by any means, but it didn't really dent the market either. Although it may be a car you'd want to see, I don't think there are enough buyers in that market to justify making a car like that top priority. I'm betting Dodge sold a lot more base Neons than they did SRT4s.

Caddillac has been getting sportier. Look at any Caddy pre-90s. Large, slow, luxury. Now they've got the CTS-V and another sports car that I can't think of the name of. They had that cool "sixteen" concept, and the Escalade is drooled over by more youth than any new Caddy was pre-90s.

Olds is dead, I think the last model year was 04 or so. Looking at my 99 Alero, I can see why they went out. It seems to be below the quality of like-priced GMs (maybe I just got a crappy one) and to be honest it's boring.
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Old 10-23-2007, 09:27 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by giant016
First off, you don't see a lot of Hummers because they're a niche vehicle. It's not necissarily that they aren't selling, you aren't seeing many because GM is doing what they should be doing with all there cars by not overflowing a declining market with them. .
Thats true. I still drive by a Hummer dealership every day and seem to see the same cars there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by giant016
GM tried the small sporty car for kids with the Cobalt SS SC. Not a bad car by any means, but it didn't really dent the market either. Although it may be a car you'd want to see, I don't think there are enough buyers in that market to justify making a car like that top priority. I'm betting Dodge sold a lot more base Neons than they did SRT4s.
Dodge DID sell more neons than SRT-4s. I never said it should be top priority, but it should have at least some importance in their lineup, otherwise they are leaving that market open to the competition. The Cobalt SS/SC was actually a really nice looking car, and performed the part from what I hear.

Quote:
Originally Posted by giant016
Caddillac has been getting sportier. Look at any Caddy pre-90s. Large, slow, luxury. Now they've got the CTS-V and another sports car that I can't think of the name of. They had that cool "sixteen" concept, and the Escalade is drooled over by more youth than any new Caddy was pre-90s.
Yes, you are thinking of the XLR, but once again, its not a luxury car, its not a sports car...then again so is the m5 but it manages to pull both areas off rather well. The escalade is loved now becuase everyone who is anyone has one...rappers, sports stars, etc. Not saying its a good car, but if its selling then so be it

Quote:
Originally Posted by giant016
Olds is dead, I think the last model year was 04 or so. Looking at my 99 Alero, I can see why they went out. It seems to be below the quality of like-priced GMs (maybe I just got a crappy one) and to be honest it's boring.
The name honestly doesnt sound very good either...Oldsmobile
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Old 10-24-2007, 06:41 PM   #10
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I do believe Weaponr has a Ninja style kit that looks AWESOME. I have the Wings stuff.
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Old 10-25-2007, 01:43 PM   #11
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I think they need to consolidate some brands.


For example, what the hell is GMC supposed to be? Every GMC vehicle is sold under another tag as well (Chevrolet).
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