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Old 01-22-2008, 09:04 AM   #46
windsonian
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newyorker
Yes but I didnt say that I changed my mind about not buying an import..I still would buy an import
huh? but you wouldn't not buy a domestic.
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Old 01-22-2008, 09:35 AM   #47
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Quote:
Originally Posted by windsonian
huh? but you wouldn't not buy a domestic.
I would, but I would be a bit more picky about it than an import. I would check the engine 5 times over and then have a mechanic look it over, I would spend about 2 weeks, reading reviews and doing research, etc. When I got my civic I just found it and bought it, and it has served me well, with only wear and tear (except for input shaft bearing..stupid 1st gear downshifts).

I gota say I really liked that 6-speed liberty we had though it was a blast..shifter is hard as hell to work with cause its not very precise or smooth but still a great time. I got pix of it I will upload as soon as my camera gets fixed..my boss decided to unplug it and the card is corrupted but the pix are OK I gota extract them

With my mindset about domestics now, something really nice would have to slap me in the face really hard to get my attention, that or a really really really good deal that if I'm not happy with I can make money on a few months down the road.
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Old 01-22-2008, 06:36 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jedimario
It's funny how you domestic supremacists always default to 2 things.

-domestics always perform better in a straight line, therefore they're better cars
-anyone who thinks otherwise is a ricer and should be burned at the stake



He also has a pos F-body.

And why on earth are you calling me a ricer? When have I ever done or said anything that even remotely resembles the ricer attitude? Show me, I challenge you. My fixed comment was more of a joke than anything, a little extreme to balance out your extreme comment. By the way, I never even came close to implying that going in a straight line is easy and corners are hard...so you're essentially arguing with nobody. Just so you know

Anyway, let's talk about the whole ignorant ricer thing. Here comes my ignorance spewing from the innermost parts of my tiny ricer brain...

Generally, performance cars made by American companies will go faster in a straight line than car made by companies from other countries, while cars made by companies from other countries will go faster than cars made by American companies "in the twisties". There are plenty of exceptions of course, but many, if not most, cars will follow that rule whether they've been modified or not.


Ok, now let's talk about this Civic vs. F-body thing, and see which car would be the best choice for me.

I am an 18 year old college student with fairly little knowledge in the way of auto mechanics who needs a car that won't break down and wants a car that would be fun to drive around on a daily basis. Modding is out of the question, since my parents own the car and won't allow it. I will also have to pay for part of the insurance. Also, mom says it must be safe.

Ok, now that we know a little bit about me, let's do a little breakdown of each car's pros and cons.

Reliability-the car just has to be. If it breaks down, I'm just out of luck until it gets fixed, cause I probably can't do it myself.

2005 Civic Si > F-body, no question there, no need to explain.

Fun/performance-not a requirement, but would be nice to have.

2005 Civic Si > F-body, and I will explain this one.

The Civic is a 2800lb, FWD hatchback. The F-body is a ~3100lb or more RWD coupe. Well, the F-body certainly has more power...but honestly going in a straight line is a bit of a bore, especially on the street. Since I will not excessively speed for risk of getting a ticket, I would run out of fun very fast just going in a straight line. Now is there really any question about which one of these is more fun going around a turn? I assume they both have relatively high front weight ratios, but I can't find any exact figures. But the Civic is at least 300-400lbs lighter. I'm told that Mustangs and Camaros and the like are total pigs in the turns, and I at least know that my Civic is better than that.

Also, just one sit in a late nineties Firebird, and I hated the thing. I felt like I was lying down, and the shifter was way stiffer than any ever should be. Speaking of shifters, the EP3 has it in an unusual, but perfect location, thus helping the fun factor quite a bit.

In short, I think my Civic is a blast, and I seriously doubt that ANY stock Mustang, Camaro, Firebird, or other muscle car would be more fun for me.

Then there's safety.

2005 Civic Si > F-body

Well, probably anyway. I'm not looking up ratings for every F-body, but the random ones I did look up were all worse than the Civic.

Insurance

2005 Civic Si < F-body

Not much there, insurance on the Civic is about 3 times more

And a couple of other things...

gas mileage

2005 Civic Si > F-body

practicality

2005 Civic Si > F-body

Anything important I'm missing?

So, you tell me, in my case, how on earth is an F-body better than a Civic Si? It's not.

Lastly, my parents bought the car so it was more up to them than me anyway. I have to take what I can get, and they were going to get something nice...nicer than most any f-body.

In summary:

I'm not a ricer, and there's no way you can legitimately say that I am.
Imports typically are faster than domestics in the twisties.
Domestics are typically faster than imports in a straight line.
A Civic Si is much better choice of car for me than an F-body, and I'm quite happy with it.

I called you a ricer, cause you defaulted to the american cars dont handle well. What basis does this statement have?
Your friends told you f-bpdys are pigs in the corner!

There are plenty of capable handling domestics and their are plenty of pigs made in japan.

Here are some stats on the F-bodys.

The 02 WS6 (according to MT)
.84 Gs
64.6 mph slalom

I really dont think thats bad at all considering the e36 did it in 63.6 mph according to MT

the 99 Firehawk (also according to MT)
.89Gs
66mph slalom

even better.

All the F-bodys that me and my firends have, have been more than reliable.
Mine at 107K miles.
Has been EXTREMELY RELIABLE
Only broken tranny caused by me
and A tore up motor due to a faulty cam dowel pin (not a GM an aftertmarket thing)
If I didnt mod it It wouldnt have broken

Buddies TA at 164K miles.
Still hold great oil pressure and the only thing hes had to fix in the last ~50K miles was 2 02 sensors.

Another Friends 02 Z28
Has had to do NOTHING to it outside of a clutch at 121K miles (the original lasted that long).

Ill give you the safety thing as Im to lazy to look them up, and I could care less about practicality in a discusion about perfromance cars but gas mileage in an F-body isnt bad at all.

I get 28mpg from a 3.73 geared (stock are 3:42) LT1 M6 Z28.
LS1s get better mileage and a stock geared car will help to.
Ive seen over 30mpg from a few f-bodys, but my best is 28.
Which isnt bad at all as far as im concerned when I have a 5.7L V8.
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Old 01-22-2008, 06:44 PM   #49
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jedimario
:

I'm not a ricer, and there's no way you can legitimately say that I am.
Imports typically are faster than domestics in the twisties.
Domestics are typically faster than imports in a straight line.
A Civic Si is much better choice of car for me than an F-body, and I'm quite happy with it.

Sure its the better choice for you, but if I had 9 kids a minivan would be the bets decision for me. That doesnt hold any merit in a perfromance discussion or a perfromance per dollar discusion though.

Your import, domestic generalizations have no backing. Thats why I call you a ricer. You cannot judge a complete set of cars on just the places they wer built. You have to judge and compare them on a smaller level.

To make generalizations like that is just retarded.

Thatd be like me saying imports do X bad. I cant cause there are always exceptions. And dont get me wrong, I like all cars for certain things (including imports).
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Old 01-22-2008, 10:34 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Enthusiast
Your import, domestic generalizations have no backing.

I really just want to say neither do yours, but I'll hold back...

Because they do have backing.

Look, this wasn't supposed to be an argument about performance cars. You made a bs statement, I called you on it. Ever heard the saying "actors use lies to tell the truth"? Same concept. Next time, realize that instead of shooting off and making bogus accusations about someone you don't even know.
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Old 01-22-2008, 11:32 PM   #51
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Originally Posted by jedimario
I really just want to say neither do yours, but I'll hold back...

Because they do have backing.

Look, this wasn't supposed to be an argument about performance cars. You made a bs statement, I called you on it. Ever heard the saying "actors use lies to tell the truth"? Same concept. Next time, realize that instead of shooting off and making bogus accusations about someone you don't even know.

If It was a BS statement then disprove it.

First off domestic performance cars usually come with big simple motors which are usually easy to make power with. Seriously right now the SBC (Gen I-IV) is hard to beat in a perfromance per dollar comaprison.

Second we have the home field advantage. Im sure its cheaper to make a japanese car faster in japan.
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Old 01-22-2008, 11:56 PM   #52
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An Enzo Ferrari will go faster in a straight line than your Camaro.
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Old 01-23-2008, 12:24 AM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newyorker
I would, but I would be a bit more picky about it than an import.
whatever.... you've still changed your mind then.
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Old 01-23-2008, 02:03 AM   #54
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An Enzo Ferrari will go faster in a straight line than your Camaro.

Yes but I could go faster than an enzo for the price of one.
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Old 01-23-2008, 02:37 AM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by windsonian
whatever.... you've still changed your mind then.
No...I would still rather have an Import, but there are certain vehicles that I think the Colonies make better trucks and SUVs, but for a car, I would rather stick to the japanese. Euro...eh..il get one if it is new or still under warranty
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Old 01-23-2008, 02:38 AM   #56
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Originally Posted by Enthusiast
Yes but I could go faster than an enzo for the price of one.
But an Enzo is a Ferrari..an F-body isnt, and your F-body would never handle like an Enzo, nor would it have the same value..
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Old 01-23-2008, 03:26 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newyorker
No...I would still rather have an Import, but there are certain vehicles that I think the Colonies make better trucks and SUVs, but for a car, I would rather stick to the japanese. Euro...eh..il get one if it is new or still under warranty
"Rather have one" and "will not buy one" are 2 very different things. Just admit you changed your mind, even if you won't say what changed it.
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Old 01-23-2008, 05:19 AM   #58
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Quote:
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Yes but I could go faster than an enzo for the price of one.

So could I...stay on topic or shut up.
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Old 01-23-2008, 06:37 AM   #59
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But an Enzo is a Ferrari..an F-body isnt, and your F-body would never handle like an Enzo, nor would it have the same value..

Correction.

Your retarded. Ive seen skidpad numbers from modified F-bodys over 1Gs.
And I have also seen better slalom numbers than your almighty enzo.

Quit being a nut swinger and look shit up.

Im dont have the money to buy an enzo so its kinda a plus that an f-body wouldnt have the same value as an enzo.

Yah I no its a Ferrari. Id take the Chevy, cause I break parts and I enjoy being able to pay to have the car fixed, and not feel bad when I abuse the hell out of the car.
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Old 01-23-2008, 06:38 AM   #60
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Shit even a boxster BONE STOCK can go through the slalom faster than the enzo.
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