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Old 06-10-2004, 01:49 AM   #1
nickrand
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1994 Ford Escort Intermittent Crank/No Start Problem

I am the original owner of my '94 Ford Escort LX Wagon. It has been my first and only car but needs some help after 205,000 miles.

MAIN CONCERN

For the past few years my engine will crank but not start on the first try. This started to happen at 130,000 miles.

WHEN IT HAPPENS

This happens frequently in the summer but rarely in the winter. Problem happens in 15% of starts during summer and less than 5% of starts during winter. More likely to happen when engine is warm.

DIAGNOSTIC HISTORY

Car normally starts before an accurate diagnosis can be made. Previous error codes have been KOEO 111, KOEC 111, KOER 111.

Diagnosis at Ford service three years ago was possible intermittent EEC power relay concern and possible crank sensor concern.

POTENTIALLY RELATED PROBLEMS

I list these additional issues with the hope that they are related to my crank/no-start problem:

1) In summer when A/C is on, engine temperature will proceed up to the top of normal section in city driving. It returns to lower part of normal section at high speeds.

2) Acceleration is poor as car gets hotter. Sounds like there is a straining sound as car accelerates in hot weather once engine is warm. Car has never overheated and acceleration/engine performance is normal except during summer.

3) Sometimes A/C and other power components (e.g., wipers, headlights, etc.) do not come on right away after start-up. Most of the time they come on right away, but sometimes car must be driven for a few minutes before they work. This happens infrequently and tends to happen to the A/C more so than the other components.

4) Car has stalled a few times when speeding up quickly and then stopping right away.

5) Engine surges every now and then during acceleration.

MAINTENANCE HISTORY

Recently replaced:

- Fuel pump
- Water pump
- Timing belt
- Serpentine Belt
- Air valve
- Air sensor (cleaned only)
- A/C compressor clutch, hub, and pulley
- Exhaust flex pipe

CONCLUSION

Taking these problems together, I'm hoping that a faulty EEC relay could be the culprit. Please advise if this makes sense given the above history or if the problem is probably more complex. Any advice would be appreciated.

1994 Ford Escort LX Wagon
205,000 miles
1.9 Liter/4 cylinder/automatic
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Old 06-10-2004, 03:42 AM   #2
tbaxleyjr
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111 on an EEC-IV computer system is normal system pass
Assuming you ran Key On, Engine OFF test:

The first code 1 indicates communitation is occuring normally and the computer is in diagnostic mode

11 is a separator pulse
111 means everything in normal range.


Did you run Key On Engine Running Test?
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Old 06-10-2004, 06:06 AM   #3
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.........

Last edited by Wally : 06-18-2004 at 12:32 AM.
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Old 06-10-2004, 11:34 AM   #4
nickrand
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wally
This is going to be one of those problems that's either a very simple fix or a montage of little problems.

Being intermittent makes fault finding very frustrating doesn't it.

Its almost as if the car goes into limp mode in summer.

Have you checked all the fuses?
Have you checked the earth straps are all clean and secured, including under dash?
Have you had your neutral position switch checked out?
Have you tested the air temperature and coolant sensors?
Have you had the injectors flow tested?

Why was the fuel pump replaced?

****************

KOER was run and passed.

The fuses and sensors were checked.

Fuel pump was replaced as preventative maintenance.

I've had the fuel injectors cleaned several times.

I'm not much for diagnosing these problems myself, so my goal is to narrow down the problem to an area that someone else can test. I'd love to do it myself but don't have the knowledge or experience.

Could a fauly EEC power relay cause all of my problems?
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Old 06-10-2004, 12:08 PM   #5
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I have the EEC-IV in my Crown Victoria and know a little about it

Lets look @ what we know

car passed KOEO and KOER tests (indicated by codes 111)
Car's starting issues occcur on cold start in warmer weather
acceleration sluggish with wram engine and hot weather
Car runs much warmer with AC on than with it off

Wally or someone may have said some of this already -

Re-do your KOEO and KOER test and wigle the wiring around all of your sensors and see if you get codes - this will help identify wiring problems in the EEC-IV system

Just for good measure, I would test the coolant temperature and intake temperature sensors. These can be tested with a DIGITAL multimeter and by reading the instructions from a good manual for the car.

http://www1.autozone.com/servlet/UiB...3d8013bfbd.jsp

http://www1.autozone.com/servlet/UiB...3d80156422.jsp

provides details on how to accomplish that.

This will rule out bad temperature inputs to the ECM which will cause the car to run lean but have not gotten bad enough yet to throw codes

Next, do what Wally mentioned and check the electrical grounds

Change the fuel filter and do a presure test on the fuel system (confirm values from a shop manual) looking for 30-40 psig engine running @ idle, 40-50 psig with vacume hose disconnected from regulator, engine running , 40-50 psig engine off, key on - we are looking for blocked supply or return lines, bad fuel pump.

If these things dont find the culprit, we will commence digging into the DIS ignition system since bad ignition modules and bad cam/crank sensors cause intermittent issues on warm engines as well. The only easy way to test some of this stuff easily is spend $20 on a new crank or cam sensor and replace it. There are some voltage test to run on your coil packs and ignition module if you want to go this deep.
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Old 02-16-2006, 06:53 PM   #6
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you need to put cold spark plugs in it

you have to hot of spark plugs now it could burn up your engine
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Old 02-17-2006, 01:34 AM   #7
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hell, if it's a ford, just count yourself lucky that it starts at all...
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Old 02-17-2006, 01:38 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dodger65
hell, if it's a ford, just count yourself lucky that it starts at all...
Watch it
First On Race Day
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Old 02-17-2006, 01:43 AM   #9
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Quote:
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Watch it
First On Race Day

w/e For Our Retarded Daughter...

i told my wife that one when she had an escort and got slugged...

F*cking Old Rebuilt Datsun

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Old 02-17-2006, 02:17 AM   #10
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Quote:
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w/e For Our Retarded Daughter...

i told my wife that one when she had an escort and got slugged...

F*cking Old Rebuilt Datsun

Nice
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Old 02-17-2006, 05:14 AM   #11
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No no no....Ford= Fix Or Repair Daily
Besides that, you do realize this thread is older than crap right?
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Old 02-17-2006, 12:36 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 97Talonchik
No no no....Ford= Fix Or Repair Daily
Besides that, you do realize this thread is older than crap right?

yeah, that's why we're not answering the question or anything like that...
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