Car Forums  

Go Back   Car Forums > Vehicle Specific > Asian Imports
FAQ Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 08-04-2004, 06:49 PM   #31
ChrisV
The Big Meaney
 
ChrisV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: People's Republic of Maryland
Posts: 3,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderbird1100
I haven't asked her about it fully. All I know is she took it to a guy that builds RX-7's with any kind of swap known to man (5.0's, 350's, etc), she said the engine got in about 6 days before our trip...6 days seems plausible for most any-engine swap. Especially with someone knowing what they are doing.

Plausible, but considering that much of it still has to be fabricated, and the electronics completely custom made (the 20B swap is not a very common one yet, and if he's done enough of them to have it a plug and play like that, he'd be as famous as Pettit...), and considering shops like Pettit and PFS don't complete a 20B swap in that amount of time, I just question it.

Not to say it wasn't done. But I'd like to see pictures of it...
__________________
I'm not mean. You're just a wuss.



www.midatlantic7s.com
ChrisV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-04-2004, 07:02 PM   #32
ChrisV
The Big Meaney
 
ChrisV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: People's Republic of Maryland
Posts: 3,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by thunderbird1100
To most people I spoke to they say it's not really a 'real' hemispherical combustion chamber. You can kind of argue both sides...oh well.

The fact is that the new Dodge Hemi uses the same basic layout as the old one, with valves offset to either side of the combustion chamber. The main difference is in the dual spark plugs and the fact that there are quench areas around the edges of the chamber.

This is how the Hemi head valve arrangement is, and it's the same for the new Hemi as the old one.



Who are these "most people" you spoke to, and what do they really know about Hemis, or engines in general?
__________________
I'm not mean. You're just a wuss.



www.midatlantic7s.com
ChrisV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-04-2004, 07:08 PM   #33
ChrisV
The Big Meaney
 
ChrisV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: People's Republic of Maryland
Posts: 3,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by Zalight
And I know that replacing the seals isn't a esay matter, but its not incredibly difficult either. In fact last weekend I watched someone, who uses his RX for track racing not street use, replace his apex seals with a custom made set that cost him close to $1000. They can handle 600 horsepwoer at the flywheel for 80-100,000 miles. Which covers him since hes only running 450 RWhorse and 375 rw torque. It took him two sittings of 6-7 hours each to take apart his 13b replace the seals and put it all back together again. with a break in between where we went to get wendys tasty,tasty junior bacon cheesbugers and frosties...mmmmmmm...frosties

I've watched guys rebuild their V8s between rounds at a drag race, too. It's easy if you're familiar with it and have the tools. I've rebuilt a 12A on my dining room table (not recommended if still living at with your folks or with a spouse...)

The point is to not try to say that it's a breeze to just upgrade the apex seals and everything will be peachy.
__________________
I'm not mean. You're just a wuss.



www.midatlantic7s.com
ChrisV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2004, 02:51 AM   #34
abless
CF Anti-Mullet
 
abless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: The American Empire
Posts: 530
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisV
Contrast that to modern 1 liter sport bikes, with piston enignes that turn over 10k regularly. or the old Chevy DZ302 from the 1967-1969 Z/28 that turned 8000 rpm in stock form (yes a pushrod V8) and with minor mods, could turn 9000 rpm regularly in streetable form.


600cc sport bikes redline at 15,500 rpms. Small two strokes can rev till about 17 or 18K.

I think the idea of a rotary powered sportbikes would be pretty cool. If I remember correctly, Suzuki made a rotary bike, but discontinued it. I'll look into it.
__________________
abless is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-05-2004, 02:59 PM   #35
ChrisV
The Big Meaney
 
ChrisV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: People's Republic of Maryland
Posts: 3,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by abless
600cc sport bikes redline at 15,500 rpms. Small two strokes can rev till about 17 or 18K.

I think the idea of a rotary powered sportbikes would be pretty cool. If I remember correctly, Suzuki made a rotary bike, but discontinued it. I'll look into it.

the Suzuki RE-5. 62 hp at 6500 rpm.

http://www.rotaryrecycle.net/re5originalrelease.asp



Yamaha had a prototype in '73, and a company called Van Veen put an NSU rotary into a Moto Guzzi frame and sold them from '76-78. Norton had a number of rotary bikes in the '80s, including one that set a world speed record of 191 mph in the early '90s...
__________________
I'm not mean. You're just a wuss.



www.midatlantic7s.com
ChrisV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2004, 03:48 AM   #36
abless
CF Anti-Mullet
 
abless's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: The American Empire
Posts: 530
Thanks alot. I didn't know Yamaha, Van Veen, or Norton had made rotary bikes.
__________________
abless is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2004, 08:27 AM   #37
Unlicensed
CF Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 132
ahhh! the good old jps nortons!
weren't they banned from racing cos back then they couldn't decide what the cc rating was? something like that?

that and the fact they kept winning
Unlicensed is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-06-2004, 06:49 PM   #38
cinqyg
CF Freak
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Midlands, England
Posts: 851
well it depends on what you are trying to achive but i would say that its a very desperate effort. There are much cheaper ways of achiving almost the same result.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zalight
I know that , as with any other engine, there is a lot of work involved when trying to upgrade engine internals, and that there are more then a few things that have to be donte in order to make a very good quality engine. I was merely saying that the first things any rotary owner would want to think about upgrading would be his cooling system and his apex seals.

And I know that replacing the seals isn't a esay matter, but its not incredibly difficult either. In fact last weekend I watched someone, who uses his RX for track racing not street use, replace his apex seals with a custom made set that cost him close to $1000. They can handle 600 horsepwoer at the flywheel for 80-100,000 miles. Which covers him since hes only running 450 RWhorse and 375 rw torque. It took him two sittings of 6-7 hours each to take apart his 13b replace the seals and put it all back together again. with a break in between where we went to get wendys tasty,tasty junior bacon cheesbugers and frosties...mmmmmmm...frosties

By the way, Has anyone heard of the cryogenically frozen parts some companies offer? I heard that the U.S. government is giving out grants for people to start doing this. Apparently the freezing process forces all the impurities out of the metal leaving behind a stronger material without changing size or shape. Well it does change it but only on a very insignifagant scale. But I havent heard much beyond that. Anybody here anything about this? Does it actually work? How much does it cost?
cinqyg is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2004, 06:18 AM   #39
megamotor
CF Newbie
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 1
Exclamation no contest, rotary wins

undefined

The wankel is hugely inefficient. Combustion occurs at TDC, which means the rotor is slammed against the eccentric shaft, not driven in the direction of rotation. The rotor imprint is carved into the sidewalls on high mileage engines. At ignition the rotor is sliding nearly parallel to the chamber frame, which means the downforce is not in the direction of rotation. The power-party is over in less than 90 shaft degrees because once pressure equalizes on the full rotor face it produces no viable torque (the rotor is balanced - between going forward and backward). The Wankel is fired early and weakly to burn [poorly] the charge on the trailing end of the rotor [wasteful and polluting]. The carbon build-up is striking. The combustion chamber is long and narrow, consuming a lot of heat that should be producing pressure, and impeding full and rapid combustion. The 13b exhaust is an after burner, consuming fuel and sucking in the intake mixture in the 13b [that is why there is nominal backpressure in the renesis]. The Wankel will be remembered for the miracle that it ran at all, and for how little of the rotary potential it used.

The next generation of rotaries is coming. They will blow the papa wankel, and all reciprocating engines out of the market. Think torque limited by material strength. Mileage of 100 plus. Multiple fuel options. Rotaries will rule, utterly and completely. Two years or less.

P.S. Anybody have the torque formula for the wankel? Or the engine on CAD? THANKS.

Last edited by megamotor : 11-22-2004 at 06:27 AM. Reason: P.S.
megamotor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2004, 07:29 PM   #40
TopRPm
CF Newbie
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 9
I have a very simple staistic to post
RX8 1.3 liter engine
output: 250 hp @8500 rpm
S2000
2.0 Liter engine
240 @ 8300rpm

thats why I'm 3k away from owning an RX8 of my own!!!
TopRPm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-01-2004, 05:43 PM   #41
Inygknok
El del Supra
 
Inygknok's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Puerto Rico
Posts: 1,863
Quote:
Originally Posted by TopRPm
I have a very simple staistic to post
RX8 1.3 liter engine
output: 250 hp @8500 rpm
S2000
2.0 Liter engine
240 @ 8300rpm

thats why I'm 3k away from owning an RX8 of my own!!!



the rx8 is actually ESTIMATED at 238bhp at the FLYWHEEL, not the rear wheels. the rear wheel hp is much different (not that much, but its the important number) to that of the hp at the flywheel or crank.
__________________


Supra: To surpass or go beyond.
Inygknok is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-05-2004, 05:29 AM   #42
Zalight
Who's house? Runs house.
 
Zalight's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Albuquerque, New Mexico
Posts: 2,264
Besides that I wouldn't get the RX8, mazda announced Possible plans for a MK4 RX7 that will be based off the 8 but will be a true coupe instead of a quad coupe and have a supercharger on top of the renesis, oh and it's probably going to be brought up to a 1.6 liter.

All this leads to rumors of 340 bhp, but who knows. Makers announce plans for stuff that never gets made all the time.

I saw this on a rotary forum:
http://www.ads234.com/adView.aspx?re... 875&Segment=1

It looks kinda photoshopped so I don't know if its real.
__________________
1999 BMW ///M3
Zalight is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2004, 09:50 PM   #43
ChrisV
The Big Meaney
 
ChrisV's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: People's Republic of Maryland
Posts: 3,714
Quote:
Originally Posted by TopRPm
I have a very simple staistic to post
RX8 1.3 liter engine
output: 250 hp @8500 rpm
S2000
2.0 Liter engine
240 @ 8300rpm

thats why I'm 3k away from owning an RX8 of my own!!!

remember this, the 13B is nominally rated at 1.3 liters, but it's essentially a 2 stroke in that all four cycles happen on 1 revolution of the combustion chamber. that means it has one power stroke for every revolution of the crank. It uses it's full rated displacement to make power at any given rpm.

The S2000 engine, like all 4 stroke piston engines, has one power stroke every OTHER revolution of it's crank. Therefore it is using half it's actual displacement to make power at any given rpm.

This disparity in power strokes is why racing bodies class the 13B as a 2.6 liter engine, just like they'd class a 1 liter 2 stroke as a 2 liter engine (and you'll notice that in motorcycle road racing, 2 strokes are considered teh equivalent of 4 strokes that are double the displacment.)

this is also why the 1.3 liter rotary gets approximately the same fuel mileage as a 2.6 liter engine at the same hp levels.
__________________
I'm not mean. You're just a wuss.



www.midatlantic7s.com
ChrisV is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2005, 07:38 AM   #44
revv_head
CF Newbie
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Sydney, NSW, Australia
Posts: 8
revvs

Rotarys might revv high but that just means you have to push it harder to get max power rotarys dont like revving at 9000rpm you can wreck the engine in 5 minutes doing that in a rotary yet in any car a rotary revvs high but it only likes revving high at mabe 5500 6500 max weras a piston you get max power at 4000-5800rpm which can be easily done for a time besides i get my 1990 celica up to 8500 and i feel it loses power from when it goes past 6700 rpm so you dont need a full 9000rpm
revv_head is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2005, 10:13 AM   #45
GreekWarrior
CF Extraordinaire
 
GreekWarrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: "Down-under"
Posts: 2,369
Quote:
Originally Posted by revv_head
Rotarys might revv high but that just means you have to push it harder to get max power rotarys dont like revving at 9000rpm you can wreck the engine in 5 minutes doing that in a rotary yet in any car a rotary revvs high but it only likes revving high at mabe 5500 6500 max weras a piston you get max power at 4000-5800rpm which can be easily done for a time besides i get my 1990 celica up to 8500 and i feel it loses power from when it goes past 6700 rpm so you dont need a full 9000rpm

Ooooooooooold Tttttttttttthread.
__________________

GreekWarrior is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Forum Jump



All times are GMT +1. The time now is 06:32 PM.

Powered by vBulletin Version 3.5.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2002 - 2011 Car Forums. All rights reserved.